[EVDL List]

We know who the true problem is. I have left the evdl and the eaa. This
isn't the first time children have made my job of trying to promote electric
vehicles difficult. I've had many comments from people looking into the ev
world from the outside asking me if we are so conscious of the earth why
can't we be conscious of our own members. The ev movement is at a
standstill in the public eye and we are bickering amongst ourselves in the
public eye instead of settling our differences like men and leaders of the
ev world between each other privately. Anyone who tries to drag everyone
into the arguement is only acting like a child.
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[EVDL List]

I have to agree with John on this one. A little bit of chatter that can
easily be ignored and some people are freaking out. The world at large has
no idea what's going on in this very small discussion list and it will have
no effect on the success or failure of EVs. The more EV's catch on the more
we can expect conflict because of the greater diversity of participants,
that's the nature of humanity.


[quote]John G. Lussmyer wrote:
>
> On 5/18/2011 8:11 AM, Michael Clark wrote:
>> We know who the true problem is.
>
> Yup.
> 1) A (very) few people that act like children.
> 2) A bunch of people that seem to think that if more than a 0.1% of
> message traffic in a year involves the children, then the whole
> "movement" (whatever that is) is a total loss and they should go start
> their own.
>
> The latter is the bigger problem.
> Some of us have actually learned to
> A) Ignore the children - including using things like the delete key, and
> even (gasp!) kill/ignore files.
> B) Understand that little flare ups happen in EVERY group that isn't run
> by a dictator, and live with them.
>
> Sheesh.
>
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[EVDL List]

This is one of the funniest arguments to me that gets made. We are so sure that our little lists and forums are so important that we must protect them from any nonsense. The same argument is used by those who keep stoking the flames because they have been wronged in a public forum and so must set the record straight in that same forum...
Seriously, this whole thing was sent to a couple thousand peoples mailboxes. An unknown percentage of them were amused by it, an unknown percentage totally ignored it, and a few are so offended by it that they had to jump into the fray or start side conversations about how awful the whole thing is. I'm guessing that probably less than a hundred people out of the billions there are in the world fall into that last category.
Personally I'm in the amused category... kinda like watching a reality tv show you really know you shouldn't be enjoying but you do anyway
damon

> Date: Wed, 18 May 2011 11:06:54 -0700
> From: xxx@xxx.xxx
> To: xxx@xxx.xxx.edu
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Leaving the evdl
>
> Hi Folks,
>
> While I greatly respect the opinions many people have on this group, I
> have to agree with the decision made by the moderator. If this messages
> on this list were only stored in email, it might be ok - the delete key
> would work quite well. The problem is that this list is stored on at
> least one website (e.g. DIY Electric Car Forum), and those email will be
> there forever (in internet terms that is).
>
> We need to remember that all of our communication is seem in a wider
> context than just your email application. Civility and decorum are a
> necessity.
>
> Thanks for your time.
> Peter


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[EVDL List]

[quote]damon henry wrote:

> This is one of the funniest arguments to me that gets made. We are so sure
> that our little lists and forums are so important that we must protect them
> from any nonsense.

I don't think that is quite it. Perhaps only a (relatively) small number of people receive these messages directly in their inboxes as the exchange takes place, but these messages are archived publicly and over time may eventually be read by a much larger number of people (or not, depending on your take ;^).

It isn't really a matter of thinking that our lists are so important as it is that many participants in the list put a reasonable amount of care, time, and thought into their contributions in an attempt to help those interested in building or maintaining, etc., an EV. When this sort of non-productive (though admittedly sometimes entertaining, in a reality-TV sort of way, as you note ;^) content pollutes the pool, it can undermine the integrity and value associated with *all* archived content. At the very least, it can increase the effort required to separate the wheat from the chaff when searching the archives that people give up and go elsewhere.

Cheers,

Roger.


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[EVDL List]

Roger,
You make some very valid points that I had not considered. I was only thinking of it from my perspective as a long time list member who has waded through many of these occasional flare ups.
damon


> It isn't really a matter of thinking that our lists are so important as it is that many participants in the list put a reasonable amount of care, time, and thought into their contributions in an attempt to help those interested in building or maintaining, etc., an EV. When this sort of non-productive (though admittedly sometimes entertaining, in a reality-TV sort of way, as you note ;^) content pollutes the pool, it can undermine the integrity and value associated with *all* archived content. At the very least, it can increase the effort required to separate the wheat from the chaff when searching the archives that people give up and go elsewhere.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Roger.


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[EVDL List]

I doubt there is a message board on the internet that doesn't have it's share
of squabbles for all to see. A few nasty arguments don't negate the
majority of useful information.

[quote]Roger Stockton wrote:
>
> damon henry wrote:
>
>> This is one of the funniest arguments to me that gets made. We are so
>> sure
>> that our little lists and forums are so important that we must protect
>> them
>> from any nonsense.
>
> I don't think that is quite it. Perhaps only a (relatively) small number
> of people receive these messages directly in their inboxes as the exchange
> takes place, but these messages are archived publicly and over time may
> eventually be read by a much larger number of people (or not, depending on
> your take ;^).
>
> It isn't really a matter of thinking that our lists are so important as it
> is that many participants in the list put a reasonable amount of care,
> time, and thought into their contributions in an attempt to help those
> interested in building or maintaining, etc., an EV. When this sort of
> non-productive (though admittedly sometimes entertaining, in a reality-TV
> sort of way, as you note ;^) content pollutes the pool, it can undermine
> the integrity and value associated with *all* archived content. At the
> very least, it can increase the effort required to separate the wheat from
> the chaff when searching the archives that people give up and go
> elsewhere.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Roger.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> |
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> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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[EVDL List]

> participants in the list put a reasonable amount of care, time, and thoug=
ht into their contributions in an attempt to help those interested in build=
ing or maintaining, etc., an EV> >. When this sort of non-productive (t=
hough admittedly sometimes entertaining, in a reality-TV sort of way, as yo=
u note ;^) content pollutes the pool, At the very least, it can increase=
the effort required to separate the wheat from the chaff when searching th=
e archives that people give up and go elsewhere. Roger.>>>>

This is why when somebody post a answer and its a bad answer to a
question others really need to say something so bad info dosen't get
saved as fact. What happened to "OT" , maybe any post with OT could
some how not be archived .
Steve Clunn
--
Tomorrows Ride TODAY !
Visit our shop web page at: www.Greenshedconversions.com

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[EVDL List]

Gentlemen, I have given myself an education just reading the posts your
organization puts out to the public at large. I'm not the sharpest tool in
the shed, but I know enough to listen and learn from the experinces of
others more knowlegable than myself. I've read all the the posts on your
forum for about a year now. Some are good, some mediocre, doesn't matter
I've learned from all. I don't know any of you and don't care if I ever get
to meet you. I'm here for the information and little else. My point is I
don't care who gets on with who. Just don't quit something that is making a
difference to regular people out there, like me.I have an 81 jet van I would
have never gotten operating if it wasn't for people like you. thankyou for
your time and knowledge. Dan Payne

[quote] Steve Clunn <xxx@xxx.xxx> wrote:

> > participants in the list put a reasonable amount of care, time, and
> thought into their contributions in an attempt to help those interested in
> building or maintaining, etc., an EV> >. When this sort of non-productive
> (though admittedly sometimes entertaining, in a reality-TV sort of way, as
> you note ;^) content pollutes the pool, At the very least, it can increase
> the effort required to separate the wheat from the chaff when searching the
> archives that people give up and go elsewhere. Roger.>>>>
>
> This is why when somebody post a answer and its a bad answer to a
> question others really need to say something so bad info dosen't get
> saved as fact. What happened to "OT" , maybe any post with OT could
> some how not be archived .
> Steve Clunn
> --
> Tomorrows Ride TODAY !
> Visit our shop web page at: www.Greenshedconversions.com<http://www.greenshedconversions.com/>
>
> _______________________________________________
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Dan (Gentlemen and Gentlewoman),
I hope you haven't found my posts mediocre (not to mention my posts in
the archive), I don't care if I ever meet you either, I don't care to
get on with you, and you are welcome, I think!
-- =

Suck Amps,
Dave "Battery Boy" Hawkins
Check out our website!
http://bbevs.com/

Date: Thu, 19 May 2011 16:06:16 -0500
From: Dan Payne

Gentlemen, I have given myself an education just reading the posts your
organization puts out to the public at large. I'm not the sharpest tool =
in
the shed, but I know enough to listen and learn from the experinces of
others more knowlegable than myself. I've read all the the posts on your
forum for about a year now. Some are good, some mediocre, doesn't matter
I've learned from all. I don't know any of you and don't care if I ever get
to meet you. I'm here for the information and little else. My point is I
don't care who gets on with who. Just don't quit something that is making a
difference to regular people out there, like me.I have an 81 jet van I would
have never gotten operating if it wasn't for people like you. thankyou for
your time and knowledge. Dan Payne

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