[tomofreno]

Originally Posted by HPEVS

The AC50 on 115 volts works well in S10's & Rangers as long as you keep the manual trans and shift it. The new 144 volt system produces 110 ft lbs of torque to 4000 RPM which is more than sufficient to run a small P/U truck. My daily driver is a Scion xB which weighs in at 3400 pounds running the AC51/144 volt system, it makes a great commuter vehicle. Top speed is 90+. Brian

To clarify, by "the new 144 volt system" I think Brian means the new AC51 motor and the new 144V nominal controller, not the new controller and the AC50 which would only have about 80 ft-lb peak torque with the new controller peak current of 500A (please correct if wrong Brian). I realize he did not say the latter, but since the OP mentioned the AC50 it might be taken that way.

Brian will likely get some arguments here that it would "work well in S10's and Rangers", since a number of folks here think "work well" means 0 to 60 mph in less than 12 seconds. Maybe better to give numbers. I can give some indication, my 2260 lb Swift does 0 to 60 mph in 16 seconds (three shifts) with 90 ft-lb peak torque from the AC50 with 550A controller. The truck might weigh what, 50% more, and the AC51/144V would give 22% greater peak torque. I would guess the OP would be looking at 0 to 60 mph time in the low 20's seconds. Which might be just fine to him, or not.

[onegreenev]

It would work but it would be a slug. If you don't mind slow accelerations then yes. I think the AC50/AC51 and associated controllers are designed for mid to small vehicles like fiberglass reproductions. Even then they are not screamers. So I can't imagine pushing an S-10 with it. Seems to me to be a bit of strain on the system. I would not subject one to that in an S-10. A small fiberglass reproduction maybe if you don't mind fair performance.

[HPEVS]

You are correct Tom. The AC51 will be teamed up with the 144 volt controller. I think what some of the problem is where people start talking about torque and acceleration is they think normal driving is zero to 60 in sub 10 seconds when it is not. Also, people have to realize that electric motors produce all of their torque at zero RPM where an ICE needs to build that torque and usually doesn't hit it's peak until 3000+ rpm.

Brian

[dragonsgate]

Originally Posted by HPEVS

I think what some of the problem is where people start talking about torque and acceleration is they think normal driving is zero to 60 in sub 10 seconds when it is not.

Brian

Its not? I have been looking at the HPEV AC systems and from what I have seen so far think they are a very good setup. I have thought about switching to an AC but am worried that I will loose some acceleration. My old advance DC is not the fastest rig but it is quicker than a stock Fiat. That’s not saying much as just about anything is quicker that the old Fiats. I can’t fathom any guy being happy owning and driving a car that didn’t have a little snap in the take off.

[HPEVS]

Originally Posted by dragonsgate

Its not? I have been looking at the HPEV AC systems and from what I have seen so far think they are a very good setup. I have thought about switching to an AC but am worried that I will loose some acceleration. My old advance DC is not the fastest rig but it is quicker than a stock Fiat. That’s not saying much as just about anything is quicker that the old Fiats. I can’t fathom any guy being happy owning and driving a car that didn’t have a little snap in the take off.

It's tough to say if you will have more or less torque switching to an AC50 over the ADC you have now. There are a lot of different controller options available for DC than AC, so you can put 2000 amps to the motor to get all kinds of starting torque. But, usually DC setups start losing torque at lower RPMs than AC.

[dragonsgate]

Here is an excerpt of an email I just got from an EV owner who I asked some questions about his Ac 50 setup.

"You are correct with the plug n' play comment, I have worked on a few DC conversions and the HPEV set up was very simple. The motor is rated to 5500rpm and I take 3rd up to 5k frequently. I wish I had a chance to drive the car with the old DC set up to compare, but I never use 1st and commonly leave it in 3rd in city. The torque is plenty for these light cars, rated for 3800#'s. Up hills it does pretty good 2000-3500rpm even in forth.
Over all I am pretty happy with the system. The regen really saves the brakes."

[tomofreno]

Originally Posted by dragonsgate

Here is an excerpt of an email I just got from an EV owner who I asked some questions about his Ac 50 setup.

"...The motor is rated to 5500rpm and I take 3rd up to 5k frequently..."

The max rpm of the AC50/1238-7501 or 7601 controllers is 8000 rpm.

[dragonsgate]

"The motor is rated to 5500rpm and I take 3rd up to 5k frequently. "

Originally Posted by tomofreno

The max rpm of the AC50/1238-7501 or 7601 controllers is 8000 rpm.

All the better.

[tomofreno]

Originally Posted by HPEVS

It's tough to say if you will have more or less torque switching to an AC50 over the ADC you have now. There are a lot of different controller options available for DC than AC, so you can put 2000 amps to the motor to get all kinds of starting torque. But, usually DC setups start losing torque at lower RPMs than AC.

For dragon: Here is a graph of calculated available wheel torque versus vehicle speed for an AC50 and ADC 8" motor in my car (www.evalbum.com/3060):
AC50, 8 inch ADC.pdf
Available wheel torque is the max torque the motor/controller can produce at the wheels at a given speed if you floor it. The max acceleration available at a given speed depends on the difference in that and the required wheel torque - which is the torque required to move the car at a given constant speed (also shown in the graph). The intersection of the other curves with the required wheel torque gives the top speed for a given gear.

For the two controllers given in the graph title (both with peak 550A current), it is clear the car should accelerate more quickly with the AC50. I don't know how much more current you can put through an 8" ADC (not 2000A though), nor what the max voltage is you can use with it. The highest voltage curve I found for it was 132V, about 15% higher, which wouldn't change much.

Another data point: My car does 0 to 40 mph in 8 seconds (one shift). If you want 0 to 60 mph in less than 10 seconds then you should switch to a 9" DC motor and 1000A controller.

[Tesseract]

Originally Posted by HPEVS

...But, usually DC setups start losing torque at lower RPMs than AC.

The power output of *any* motor is the product of its torque and RPM. Thus, for a DC system to start losing torque at a lower RPM than an AC system it must either have started off at a higher torque in the first place or be a lower power system. Either way, it's not an apples to apples comparison.