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Re-using complete Leaf Drive System (w/VCM)

226K views 301 replies 53 participants last post by  hbthink 
#1 · (Edited)
Updated with progress 12/11/2015

Goals:

- Identify minimum set of components needed to re-use a Nissan Leaf drivetrain outside a Leaf, retaining basic functionality of charging, driving, and regen braking.
- Transplant the complete drive system from a salvaged Nissan Leaf into a new vehicle.
- Document size, weight, and interoperability requirements of major components to reduce risks to others considering this conversion path.

Strategy:

My intention is to operate the Leaf drive system as closely as possible to how it was originally intended by Nissan. In general this will mean using as much of the Leaf's components as necessary to convince them that they are still in a properly functioning Leaf and operate to as normal. While I am also interested in the possibility of operating individual components independently and/or modifying / enhancing their function, that's not the focus of this particular project for the time being.

Progress:
3/2015 - Procured "rolling chasis" for eventual conversion, 1973 Saab Sonett III with prior 96V DC conversion. Very light (~1800lbs stock), very low CdA (on par with 1st gen Insight), pretty easy to work on with removable fiberglass body over steel frame/pans.
4/2015 - Completed initial survey of failsafe modes of major systems using the factory service manuals.
5/2015 - Procured a 2012 Nissan Leaf SL from salvage auction, began testing and teardown.
5/2015 - Successfully rewired Leaf HV battery into two symmetrical 1/2 packs.
6/2015 - Demonstrated Leaf operating in torn down state with various combinations of systems omitted.
7/2015 - Completed removal of all major components from Leaf.
11/2015 - Completed successful tabletop demo of Leaf drive system charging, going ready, and into D/N/R.
12/2015 - Documented most harness connectors required for operation.
12/2015 - Documented size, weight of most major components.

At this time, here are the main components I believe are required to get the Leaf Drive System running and charging. Items marked with a (*) must all be from the same vehicle, or will require reprogramming with factory Consult III+ tool. Although the rest of these components could be sourced from different vehicles, junk yards, or even new, getting as much as possible from a single salvaged vehicle is probably the most practical / cost effective strategy for this particular approach given the number of components required. The added benefit too is that I will probably end up using many more parts from the Leaf (Cooling system, HVAC, lighting control, keyless entry, radio, NAV, etc) since its there and already integrated. Additional components beyond whats listed here are likely to be required to get regenerative braking operational, but exactly what is unproven at this time.

1. Traction Motor w/ Park Lock Mechanism
2. Inverter
3. DC/DC J/B (Charge relays, DC/DC converter)
4. VCM* (Voltage Control Module, like ECM)
5. BCM* (Body Control Module, mainly for security related functions)
6. Smart Key*
7. Complete Battery Box*
a. LBC* (Lithium Battery Controller, BMS)
b. Battery Modules
c. Battery JB (Main System Relays, Contactors)
d. Battery Low Voltage Harness (LB connectors)
e. Battery HV Disconnect (or interlock defeat, though disconnect strongly recommended)
f. Battery temp sensors x4
g. If not using complete box as is you can omit the box itself, battery heaters, battery heater relay. May need additional HV cabling in place of bus bars if not using original box.
8. ESC (Electronic Shift Control)
9. Shift Selector
10. Power Button
11. NATS Receiver
12. Main (lower) combination meter
13. OBC (On Board Charger)
14. Charge Ports
15. Pedal Box (Brake and Accelerator switches and sensors, if not from same vehicle _may_ need Consult III+ to set brake stroke sensor zero position)
16. IPDM and all fuse/relay boxes
17. 12V Battery
18. All HV Wiring Harnesses (Battery Internal, Battery to DCJB, QC Port to DCJB, OBC to DCJB & Charge Port, Inverter to Motor, Inverter to DCJB, Heater to DCJB (or interlock defeat), AC Comp to DCJB (or interlock defeat).
19. Motor Control LV Harness (Traction motor, Inverter, Park Lock, Heater, QC interlock, DCJB)
20. Motor Room LV Harness (Cooling, Accelerator, Brake, VCM, QC Port, 12V Power/GND)
21. Main LV Harness (Combination Meter, ESC, BCM, Power Switch, NATS Amplifier)
22. Body LV Harness (HV Battery, OBC, BCM)

With these components, the system should initiate and charge from LV1/2 and QC (not tested), should go ready and shift from Park to D/N/R and return to park. Power cycling should work as normal, and though DTCs are reported none should need to be cleared between cycles. In this state, the following DTCs and warnings should be displayed:
Current DTCs:
BCM:
U1000 CAN Com
U0415 Vehicle Speed (ABS)
B2557 Vehicle Speed (ABS / Comb Meter mismatch)
B2626 Outside 1 Antenna
B2627 Outside 2 Antenna
B2628 Outside 3 Antenna (door key sensors, likely a few more of this type if interior sensors disconnected)
Charger: OK None
EV/HEV (VCM):
P31B3 CAN Error (AC Auto Amp)
P3194 CAN Error (ABS)
P3195 CAN Error (IBU)
U1000 CAN Com
P31B9 CAN Error (Electronic Parking Brake)
P31EE AC Refrigerant Pressure Sensor
P31E8 Water Pump 1
P31EA Water Pump 2
HV Battery: OK
IPDM: OK
Meter:
U1000 CAN Com
Motor Control: OK
Shift:
U1000 CAN Com

Dash shows I-Key error (due to missing door sensors I believe) and T/M System Malfunction (likely multiple causes, probably IBU/ABS mainly) as well as warning lights for PS (power steering not connected), BRAKE (parking brake not connected), traction control/VDC (ABS not connected), ABS, Brakes warning (IBU/pressure sensor), airbag (not connected), EV System warning, headlight warning (not connected)

Regenerative braking will be studied more once I start putting the system into the new vehicle. The system as it stands now _may_ have pedal off regen, but no other regen as its the IBU that sends braking force requests to the VCM. At a minimum adding regen will require addition of the IBU/master cylinder. It may also require the ABS unit and/or EPS but this is still unclear. Depending on how things work out, my initial build will probably include the IBU, possibly wheel speed sensors, possibly ABS but probably not EPS controller. After testing we'll see where we go from there.

Although not listed above as you can technically operate without it, you will need some means of cooling the HV components (motor, DCJB, Charger, Inverter) either using the stock radiator, fans, and water pumps or something else.

Any HV components not used (example heater, AC Compressor) will require some means of defeating the HV interlock check. The VCM looks for connectivity at all HV connections, and will not let the system be enabled without it.

My working list of component weights and dimensions can be seen here, with dimensioned photos showing more detail beginning on page 8 of this thread.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/12rXYxqdnux7NaZTLxCUlh_WIbJlKeKVEoCvvYmTAmaw/edit?usp=sharing

My working list of harness connectors (referenced to 2012 service manual notation) is here:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1mwp0npqVMoTADt26c1_NvXiB-2EVsTHTQsyyn4HAigw/edit?usp=sharing

My summary of the DTC failsafe conditions from various controllers can be found here:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1L6-BZ-tbyuR7V2o-B8_pewGph_tKKjo8etcJuW12-jg/edit?usp=sharing

Youtube videos I've posted related to this project:
Initial Teardown and component locations:


Tabletop demo Pt1 (demonstrating ready, Shift to D/N/R):


Tabletop demo Pt2 (demonstrating charging, fast ready, no DTC clear needed)


Other projects I know of using Leaf drive system in a similar way:
http://ecomodder.com/forum/showthre...f-drivetrain-into-02-honda-insight-30966.html
http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php/85-supra-conversion-89391.html

If you have a similar project going let me know, and I'll add a link! Please feel free to share your experiences with the Leaf system on this page and I'll try to incorporate into the summary here as well.

Rob
 
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#115 ·
Awesome Kevin, love seeing this start to catch on! Please share the link when you have one.

I would think a Leaf drive in a VW Bus would be pretty awesome. Must be almost double the stock HP and Torque, and with the weight reduction it might not fare much worse than the stock Leaf on range at least at reasonable speeds. Should be impressive with double the battery. Are you going for the whole FWD stack in the back of the Bus?

Rob
 
#124 ·
Awesome Kevin, love seeing this start to catch on!
Thanks for the inspiration :D

I would think a Leaf drive in a VW Bus would be pretty awesome. Must be almost double the stock HP and Torque, and with the weight reduction it might not fare much worse than the stock Leaf on range at least at reasonable speeds.
When new the VW Bus would have had 30-50 bhp :p

Range will be interesting... obviously the VW Bus aerodynamics are pants and the 48kWh battery will weigh more than 400kg (880lbs)... but cruising at 50-60mph is the norm and I hope that with CHAdeMO it will make a practical vehicle for touring :cool:

Are you going for the whole FWD stack in the back of the Bus?
I'm upgrading the suspension using a Red9 IRS on the back... it looks as if the whole Leaf motor/inverter/charger stack will fit without cutting the bus... I will know more when the IRS arrives in December :)
 

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#116 · (Edited)
Hi

Recently i got a Leaf motor and transmission and i am preparing for a conversion.
Also i found good AC compressor. Can any of you tell me how is it started? From Nissan documentation it looks like it has a serial port. Can you see if a CAN string is required to start compressor and/or how?
My idea is to start AC in donor car, using custom microcontroler and compressor would turn on and did its job.
You have any data on compressor operation?

tnx
 
#117 ·
Sorry, I don't. My setup retains the VCM and AC amplifier to talk to the compressor. But I believe you are right, the VCM and AC amplifier talk to each other over CAN, but the AC amplifier communicates directly to the compressor via a two wire serial like interface.

Rob
 
#119 · (Edited)
I checked factory manuals. It seems only UART serial is neccessary to run compressor.
AC amp sends serial command as compressor target rpm and then receives back actual rpm.
Would you be able to record their serial string as AC amp signals compressor start, when compressor reaches working rpm and some signals in between? Maybe use some serial terminal logger?

My idea would be to start compressor with old AC clutch signal and cars own AC would command compressor trough some microcontroller that would provide serial comms and also some time buffer in case of short on/off states. System would be digital mostly, wasting some energy but it could work.
This way electric compressor could be used in any donor car.

Are you able to record working system? I tought it is best to bugg you since you have the system out and accessible. Is AC working?

tnx
 
#120 ·
RX8 is in the bodyshop. New 32KWH battery pack, chademo inlet and a facelift :-D. Same Kostov 11Alpha and Soliton1 that powered it before the accident. Cant wait - getting bored of the leaf now!

This is the latest project (unveiled yesterday):
https://twitter.com/Indra_rt/status/772394218409033728
 
#126 ·
Well, very good!

I have tried the motor and transmission and they work ok with sinus inverter. I will build Pauls inverter now.
However my interest for future built is also in Leaf AC compressor. Since you can run your system, can you record serial string from AC module to compressor? I would need ascii or hex caracters from system start to when functional compressor rpm is reached ie. when AC is working fine :). Can you record that on your system using some serial terminal?

tnx

Arber
 
#125 ·
I doubled up modules after having a discussion with Wolf regarding the Leaf BMS... I had new busbars made and cut up the insulators to accommodate them (I purchased new insulators direct from Nissan for $100 each). I'm trying to reuse Leaf parts because they are readily available at low cost :cool:

I'll start a new thread on my build :)
 

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#128 ·
Hi, that would be great!

AFAIK Compressor has its own inverter inside. It runs off 350VDC but is controlled by some UART serial interface. There is a 4 pin connector F10 (small pins) on compressor. Pins are 12V VCC pin 4 and GND pin 3, pin 2 is TX and Pin 1 is RX from A/C computer.
Pdf files of wiring attached.

I would need recording from RX pin 1 on compressor side. I.e. what commands is the A/C computer sending to start compressor and keep it at speed. You could use a computer with RS232 to USB converter and some terminal software like RS232 Port Logger or Free Serial Analyzer etc...

I imagine you would connect wire from connector F10 pin 1 to pin 2 of serial connector DB9 and F10 pin 3 to DB9 pin 5 as GND. If you connect GND then signals will have same reference and you dont have to connect VCC too.
http://www.db9-pinout.com/

tnx

A
 

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#130 ·
I installed 4R7 resistors on each of the 9 air bag connections today... this fools the SRS diagnosis sensor into turning off the air bag warning light and stops DTCs from being generated :)

In the long term I want to emulate the air bag module via CAN. However, for now this simple hardware hack will do :cool:
 

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#178 ·
I installed 4R7 resistors on each of the 9 air bag connections today... this fools the SRS diagnosis sensor into turning off the air bag warning light and stops DTCs from being generated
Ah yes, I had the same idea and have used this trick on other cars as well.
I checked the wiring diagram in the Service Manual, I believe you have a 2013+ and found that the odd number is caused by the fact that only the driver has a lap pre-tensioner in addition to the seatbelt pre-tensioner. In fact, I believe only one DTC is generated for either squib as I needed a resistor on both wires to quiet the last DTC. Passenger only has the seatbelt pre-tensioner.
One question - both the driver and passenger front airbag (steering wheel and dash mounted) show two squibs which are independently wired to the SRS computer, which brings the total number of squibs to 11:
2x steering wheel
2x dash
2x curtain l+r
2x shoulder l+r
2x seatbelt l+r
1x lap (driver only)
Is the car that you have stripped equipped with fewer airbags or did you trick the double-squibbed outputs with a single resistor?
Indeed my aim is also to extinguish all lights on the dash, since the truck that I am involved in retains the original dash and I prefer to be able to see a serious problem in a light turning on, so I can't just black out the fault lights (I could do that with the airbag light, but it will still light the general red error light as well as throwing up the display messages).
So, you do not need to connect the sensors in order to have no airbag DTCs?
 
#151 ·
I am involved with a light truck that has received the complete drivetrain from a 2013 Leaf (provided by 67BGTEV and Mike) including the halfshafts and front suspension and wheels plus all computers and wiring.
The battery and battery management (LBC) has not been in a dry location, so the LBC got damaged and some connectors on the sense wires burned, since there is almost 100V across them, so seeping rainwater will start a violent galvanic corrosion.
Also, the LBC being destroyed and subsequently trashed by the owner of the truck caused an incomplete set of computers, so I am scouting for another 2013+ wreck to pull the necessary computers from in order to get the truck going again, fix the last errors and put it on the road. It will be some time as I have also been busy with my own Leafs and those of several neighbor/friends and my own EV truck that is receiving 2 Leaf packs. Plenty projects to keep me busy this year...
 
#152 ·
In this case if You connect other LBC to the stock VCM it will be needed to write the dealer key (or something like that) to get the VCM to work with another LBC, otherwise the speed of the motor and the car itself will be reduced to 40 km/h
 
#153 ·
Yup, I found this out quickly when I placed a different battery into my Leaf and it did not want to go faster than 25 MPH.
I had to open the original battery, remove the LBC (and wire harness since it was different than the harness in the replacement battery) and mount that all into the replacement, then I was able to drive normally again.
I have done similar things a couple times now so I am well aware of the issue.
You cannot program the LBC for a different car, only a dealer could potentially do this but they were unwilling to even give an answer if they could do this on a used battery - they only match new batteries to cars
using the unique key that comes with the new battery.
If you blow up an LBC then the best thing you can do is buy another one from the same year range (2011-2012 or 2013+) and then swap the EEPROM from the blown-up board into the replacement, so it thinks it is the original and you have a chance to bring the car back to normal operation.
 
#156 ·
Personally I think the design of the Leaf is pretty slick, with smart details like headlights shaped to reduce wind hitting the mirrors, hence the sweeping protrusions, but to each his own.
The whole reason projects like these exist is that apparently the tech of the Leaf is enviable enough to be stolen from a (crashed) Leaf and the effort put in to make it work in a different vehicle, to upgrade it to Leaf performance and features. I think that is cool.
The other project that I have going on in my garage at the moment is to make a two-headed beast, I mean - a double-pack install in an EV truck
with two BMS'es (each guarding and continuously balancing its "own" pack) and paralleling the two for driving and charging.
I am getting underway of installing the first pack so I should have the truck moving soon under Leaf battery power, but with its own controller.
Just need to reprogram the controller to allow higher charge and cutoff voltages to protect the Leaf pack.
 
#162 ·
The compressor is down low on the car surrounded by all sorts of crap and the low voltage plug is behind the high voltage plug. There is a bracket in the way of me getting anywhere close. Do you happen to know where else I might grab the UART lines? They appear to run toward a large wiring harness near the center of the engine compartment. But, getting to that is even a little tight. Perhaps I could find the wires in there if I traced down the color codes or something. I have the car in the shop today and I'll try to trace down the wires but if anyone has a quick idea or pointer to where the easiest place is, nows the time.
 
#163 · (Edited)
I have wiring and instruction for Leaf 2012 attached here. Page 26 Pin1 and Pin2 wires go from compressor to pin14 and pin18 on AC auto amplifier located in center console under display. Page 36 shows AC amp connector. Wire colour are pin14 L and Pin18 W. But it seems there are two other connectors in between as seen on page 45.

Nissan colour code:
B = Black
W = White
R = Red
G = Green
L = Blue
Y = Yellow
LG = Light Green
BR = Brown
OR or O = Orange
P = Pink
PU or V (violet) = Purple
GY or GR = Grey
SB = Sky Blue
CH = Dark Brown
DG = Dark Green

Link to Nissan Leaf docs
https://ownersmanuals2.com/make/nissan/leaf-2012-372
Hope this helped

Arber
 

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#164 ·
I believe that I found the RX and TX wires for the compressor. They do seem to run to a junction under the hood on the driver's side. The plug has 46 pins.

I tried to capture the traffic but I've run into a snag. The voltage levels for the serial lines are 5V and 1.7v. This doesn't work very well for capture with a logic analyzer as 1.7v isn't generally low enough to count as "low." This causes the analyzer to either not catch the transitions or to trigger only for less than a microsecond.

I might have to try to capture the signal with a DSO but it tends to be tough to capture for long that way. Otherwise, it would probably be required to build a circuit that has the proper response and hysteresis to turn the 5 to 1.7v signal into 5 to 0 volt so the logic analyzer accepts it. I've been trying to use a Saleae Logic (1st gen) and the levels are 0.8v is low and 2v is high. So, I could try a 2x voltage divider but that yields 2.5v and 0.9v which is rather close to the trigger point. A comparator circuit could be constructed to turn the Leaf signal into 5v / 0v logic. But, I don't have comparators just sitting around. Any fun tricks would be appreciated if someone has some way to make these levels work with a logic analyzer.

I don't know how much the compressor cares about the voltage levels. I don't know what it would do if we could decode the comm and then someone tried to drive it with 5v to 0v logic. I suppose maybe they could have used 1.7v as a way to detect an open wire or shorted condition.

So close, so far away.
 
#165 ·
The voltage levels for the serial lines are 5V and 1.7v. This doesn't work very well for capture with a logic analyzer as 1.7v isn't generally low enough to count as "low."
You could use a simple comparator, but why not 2 diodes and a pull down resistor, so you create approx 1.2V drop and measure across the resistor at voltage levels which should then be 3.8 and 0.5V?
 
#167 · (Edited)
Well i got my leaf compressor now and i also got the harness. Any news on the signals? Maybe you could put an opto on the connector at the end of the line at compressor. Like LED protected by large resistor and open collector transistor end with pullup resistor to some 5V. That way there would be signalling and minimmum amp draw on signal end.

A
 
#168 ·
Well i got my leaf compressor now and i also got the harness. Any news on the signals? Maybe you could put an opto on the connector at the end of the line at compressor. Like LED protected by large resistor and open collector transistor end with pullup resistor to some 5V. That way there would be signalling and minimmum amp draw on signal end.
A
Did you also get the high voltage wires?
I have a compressor and wires and hoses from parting out a 2011.
Checked the service manual and saw that the compressor only has 6 wires, the 2-wire control, the 2-wire HV bus, 12V and a connection to the heater pump.
 
#191 ·
Yes i have a HV wires with connectors and LV wire loom that is still joined with some other wires. LV wires jolin to large multi pin connector. I gather this goes to A/C auto amplifier.

I would like to try the compressor operation on my car battery 380Vdc but i dont know the correct UART sequence for starting and then signal for rpm setting.
When evaporator air is at 0°C compressor should stop and when temperature rises to 4°C it will start again. It should be simple integrating this with in car A/C relay. I just have to know
1. start command
2. stop command
3. maybe 2 or 3 RPM settings between 50% and 80% of compressor speed

If anyone can record signals from a working LEAF compressor i could then try to interpret and setup my micro controller to clone those signals.

There are still Tx Rx lines, that means inverter wants to put out something. I have to check if this is just reporting or it needs any response to work...

tnx

A
 
#169 · (Edited)
Hi everybody,

I am very new to EV conversion and learning from day to day. Finally, I hope to have found my solution in using a Nissan Leaf as donor car. But there are still some questions - and perhaps you can help me.

I want to use the whole Leaf system in a minimal setup. My conversion car should be a Porsche 924. There will be ABS and a brake booster, but no power steering, no a/c etc. The car will weight ca. 1.100 kg (2.400 lbs). The plan is also to go clutchless.

Porsche 924 is a transaxle car, that means motor at the front, transaxle to the rear >> gear >> RWD.

http://www.924.dk/cms/images/transaxle.gif
https://www.carid.com/images/articles/transaxle-vs-transmission/porsche-924-front-engine.jpg

Ideas (Update after Duncans post):
Transaxle and old gear goes out, instead of it I will place the unit motor + gear (old Nissan Leaf) in the back of the car. Batteries go to the front (keeping the car in balance).

Changing the pedals with Nissan Pedals, but use the old instruments (speed, rpm) by creating an interface. I just need a short info-display about capacity of the battery and charging status. Perhaps using the old fuel gage to show battery status? And for the charger a little display, that I can place somewhere?

No recuperation, no wifi, no extras... keep it simple... ;)


My questions are:

What is the minimal setup to achieve this goal? The less I need the better... :)

Could there be any problems? In a video I saw that the main display of the Leaf is necessary because of the speed signal. Is there an easy fix to that or does I need some spec. components to keep the system running?

Many thanks in advance!

btw - planning to do the conversion end of the year... so got time... :)
 
#170 ·
Hi
I would lose the transaxle as well
Use the complete Leaf motor transmission unit in the back in place of the transaxle and put the batteries in the front
I think that the early Leaf had the inverter separate but in the later ones it is on top of the motor - may make the combined unit a bit too tall
 
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