[EVDL List]

Don't take it personally, Victor. Your in a tough spot with exchange
rates. The stuff you sell is top notch, but out of most peoples price
range.

[quote] Victor Tikhonov wrote:

>
>
> Roger Heuckeroth wrote:
> ...
>> Look at Metric
>> Minds price list.. $6K- $13K for a controller and then another $5K+
>> for a motor. AC propulsion $25K. Ouch!
>
> So, prices on Metric Mind site are twice as low then; and you're still
> complaining...
>
> Seriously, prices on my site are not good indication of the cost of
> hardware. Since it is all imported, mainly high cost is due to
> low USD/Euro ratio, thanks to the wonderful state of economy we're in.
>
> I use to sell *identical* hardware almost twice as cheap in 2002-2004.
> Ask Siemens systems buyers at that time - Sheer Pullen or Gary
> Graunke.
> My prices in Euro haven't changed much, about 15% due to materials
> cost
> increase. And, profit margin percentage didn't change either.
>
> But I use to buy 1.3 Euro for 1 dollar in 2003.
> Today 1 USD worth just 63 Euro-cents (www.xe.com). What do you expect?
>
> US made EV-specific hardware could be better indication of the cost,
> but
> unfortunately there isn't any produced worthy discussing. Azure comes
> closest, but their motors' specs are quite ugly comparing to what's
> doable in this arena.
>
> I know, better than nothing, but this is different topic.
>
> --
> Victor
> '91 ACRX - someting different
> '01 in-AUDI-ble - handsome car with 0.4MW AC drive (work in progress)


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[snip]
> - easy regen. Another biggie for range extension in the stop-and-go operation
> of fork lifts

And don't forget about saving on the brake pads. That is the biggest
reason I like regen on my Gizmo. All of the stop-n-go in town driving
burns through brake pads.

--
David D. Nelson

http://evalbum.com/1328


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> And don't forget about saving on the brake pads. That is the biggest
> reason I like regen on my Gizmo. All of the stop-n-go in town driving
> burns through brake pads.

Considering how cheap brake pads are, how long they last, and how easy
they are to replace, seems like a small advantage to me.

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have regen, I'm just not ready to spend a
lot of money on it.


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[quote] Peter VanDerWal <xxx@xxx.xxx> wrote:
>> And don't forget about saving on the brake pads. That is the biggest
>> reason I like regen on my Gizmo. All of the stop-n-go in town driving
>> burns through brake pads.
>
> Considering how cheap brake pads are, how long they last, and how easy
> they are to replace, seems like a small advantage to me.
>
> Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have regen, I'm just not ready to spend a
> lot of money on it.

Let's see, my pads cost about $25/pair and I'm on my third set in 4000
miles. Yes, I like regen. I don't know if the pads are too small for
this vehicle or the calipers don't retract all the way but I'm
spending as much on brake pads as I am on electricity to charge.

For a full size vehicle, it may not be worth it, however.

--
David D. Nelson

http://evalbum.com/1328


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David

If you have gone through 3 sets of pads in 4000 miles you have serious
problems.
Going through pads that fast means you are either constantly chewing away at
them
or really frying them in stops. Unless you drive around with the brakes on
you
should get 20,000 plus miles (and usually way more) on a single set of pads.
People who drive around town dragging the brakes might see about 10,000
miles
on one set.

If the pads are too small or the callipers are not retracting away from the
rotor
or the brakes generally are undersized for the weight then you should smell
burning
pads (a lot). As I'm sure someone has mentioned before if your range is crap
then
you should be looking at the callipers not releasing. And it could be the
wrong
brake material but then this would show up as a problems for any of the
cars.

If that isn't the case then you should see if you feel any pulsing or
vibration
when braking. If not then jack the car up and spin the wheel by hand and
feel
for smooth function. If you can apply the brakes slightly and turn the wheel
and feel if it catches and then turns smooth. If it is doing any of this
then
you probably have a bad rotor or the callipers are not mounted right. If you
are going through pads this fast I'd say this is a good bet what your
problem
is. It doesn't take much to warp a rotor and they will even warp if they are
not stored or shipped properly. And it doesn't take much warp to kill pads.
You should be able to get your rotor turned for under $10. A few shops will
turn or face all rotors before installation, including brand new ones.

A set of standard pads is about $25 but you should be able to get better
materials that will handle the heat if everything else works out. Any brake
rebuilder can put new material on existing pads. There are several pad
materials
out there that will happily glow red hot and still work fine.

Dave
-----Original Message-----

[quote] Peter VanDerWal <xxx@xxx.xxx> wrote:
>> And don't forget about saving on the brake pads. That is the biggest
>> reason I like regen on my Gizmo. All of the stop-n-go in town driving
>> burns through brake pads.
>
> Considering how cheap brake pads are, how long they last, and how easy
> they are to replace, seems like a small advantage to me.
>
> Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have regen, I'm just not ready to spend a
> lot of money on it.

Let's see, my pads cost about $25/pair and I'm on my third set in 4000
miles. Yes, I like regen. I don't know if the pads are too small for
this vehicle or the calipers don't retract all the way but I'm
spending as much on brake pads as I am on electricity to charge.

For a full size vehicle, it may not be worth it, however.

--
David D. Nelson

http://evalbum.com/1328


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For subscription options, see http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev


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I also have a solectria UMOC 44TF, I am currently trying to use it after
first testing it succesfully about 4 yrs. ago. There is a long charging
time (15min for every month not in use) mentioned in the manual. After a
few hours of charging I still don't seem to get any response from the
device; I connected a 260VDC pack (of small AH batts for testing , motor
power and speed cables to the UMOC, and a homemade control box w. pot for
gas pedal, on/off, 12VDC power for controller, and some indicator lights.
The 'batt full' comes on , and when the pot is moved enough towards one end,
the 'batt empty' also comes on - is this standard behavior or is the
controller defunct?

Should the fans come on when its 'alive' or only when it overheats? Are
there any indicators showing if the thing is healthy?

Maybe I should use the DB9 connector supplied for computer connection to try
to talk to the controller from a PC. Does anyone have the program or syntax
for such comunication?

The power batts are 5Ah and can probably put out 10amps without too much
problem.

--
View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/motor-torque-question-tp441267p4531656.html
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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Does the motor move?
Connecting Halls and Phases in wrong order can cause
high current draw if this is a standard AC setup.
It can give either no (stall) or fast motor run.
The high current draw can result in battery low indication...

Hope this helps,

Cor van de Water
Chief Scientist
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: xxx@xxx.xxx Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water XoIP: +31877841130
Tel: +1 408 383 7626 Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203

-----Original Message-----
From: xxx@xxx.xxx.edu [mailto:xxx@xxx.xxx.edu] On
Behalf Of jeremy rutman
Sent: Wednesday, April 04, 2012 5:37 PM
To: xxx@xxx.xxx.edu
Subject: Re: [EVDL] motor torque question

I also have a solectria UMOC 44TF, I am currently trying to use it
after first testing it succesfully about 4 yrs. ago. There is a long
charging time (15min for every month not in use) mentioned in the
manual. After a few hours of charging I still don't seem to get any
response from the device; I connected a 260VDC pack (of small AH batts
for testing , motor power and speed cables to the UMOC, and a homemade
control box w. pot for gas pedal, on/off, 12VDC power for controller,
and some indicator lights.
The 'batt full' comes on , and when the pot is moved enough towards one
end, the 'batt empty' also comes on - is this standard behavior or is
the controller defunct?

Should the fans come on when its 'alive' or only when it overheats? Are
there any indicators showing if the thing is healthy?

Maybe I should use the DB9 connector supplied for computer connection to
try to talk to the controller from a PC. Does anyone have the program or
syntax for such comunication?

The power batts are 5Ah and can probably put out 10amps without too much
problem.

--
View this message in context:
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/motor-torqu
e-question-tp441267p4531656.html
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
Nabble.com.

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[quote]On 4 Apr 2012 at 5:06, jeremy rutman wrote:

> I connected a 260VDC pack of small AH batts for testing .... can
> probably put out 10amps without too much problem ... The 'batt full'
> comes on , and when the pot is moved enough towards one end, the 'batt
> empty' also comes on - is this standard behavior or is the controller
> defunct?

I would put a voltmeter across the battery to see what is happening to it
when you do this. It's quite possible that one or more cell has/have high
internal resistance.

>
> Should the fans come on when its 'alive' or only when it overheats? Are
> there any indicators showing if the thing is healthy?
>

Sorry, I can't answer this. If you have the pinouts for the control port,
though, you may be able to identify some status LED driver pins. The older
Brusa inverters had a "malfunction" output, for example.

> Maybe I should use the DB9 connector supplied for computer connection to
> try to talk to the controller from a PC. Does anyone have the program or
> syntax for such comunication?
>

My memory may be playing tricks on me, but I seem to recall that many years
ago, Solectria told me that the programming port on the UMOC inverters was,
unlike that on the Brusa-designed earlier inverters, passworded. This could
be a tough nut to crack. However, I think that at least one former
Solectria / Azure support person still monitors this list, and she may have
some ideas for you.

David Roden
EVDL Administrator
http://www.evdl.org/


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[quote] David Nelson <xxx@xxx.xxx> wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 23, 2008 at 4:22 AM, Peter VanDerWal <xxx@xxx.xxx> wrote:
>>> And don't forget about saving on the brake pads. That is the biggest
>>> reason I like regen on my Gizmo. All of the stop-n-go in town driving
>>> burns through brake pads.
>>
>> Considering how cheap brake pads are, how long they last, and how easy
>> they are to replace, seems like a small advantage to me.
>>
>> Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have regen, I'm just not ready to spend a
>> lot of money on it.
>
> Let's see, my pads cost about $25/pair and I'm on my third set in 4000
> miles. Yes, I like regen. I don't know if the pads are too small for
> this vehicle or the calipers don't retract all the way but I'm
> spending as much on brake pads as I am on electricity to charge.

Blimey. I'm on the original set with 40,000 miles - still with
minimal wear thanks to regen.
It's not the cost of the pads that I'd be concerned about, it's the
time and effort involved - EVs are supposed to be largely maintenance
free IMO.

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I used to have a Prius.
Many (not all) Prius owners reported that they never
replaced their brake pads, even after 200,000 miles
if they got used to mainly regen-braking (anticipation).
Some drivers had virtually no difference in pad wear
compared to plain ICE vehicles, which says everything
about their method of braking (too hard, too late
and accelerating even if they cannot pass,
resulting in more braking)
Dust from brakes is a nasty substance, so getting
less of it by not wearing your pads and throwing
all your energy away is a win-win-win.


Cor van de Water
Chief Scientist
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: xxx@xxx.xxx Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water XoIP: +31877841130
Tel: +1 408 383 7626 Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203

-----Original Message-----
From: xxx@xxx.xxx.edu [mailto:xxx@xxx.xxx.edu] On
Behalf Of Evan Tuer
Sent: Thursday, April 05, 2012 1:45 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] motor torque question

[quote] David Nelson <xxx@xxx.xxx> wrote:
> On Wed, Jul 23, 2008 at 4:22 AM, Peter VanDerWal <xxx@xxx.xxx>
wrote:
>>> And don't forget about saving on the brake pads. That is the biggest

>>> reason I like regen on my Gizmo. All of the stop-n-go in town
>>> driving burns through brake pads.
>>
>> Considering how cheap brake pads are, how long they last, and how
>> easy they are to replace, seems like a small advantage to me.
>>
>> Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have regen, I'm just not ready to
>> spend a lot of money on it.
>
> Let's see, my pads cost about $25/pair and I'm on my third set in 4000

> miles. Yes, I like regen. I don't know if the pads are too small for
> this vehicle or the calipers don't retract all the way but I'm
> spending as much on brake pads as I am on electricity to charge.

Blimey. I'm on the original set with 40,000 miles - still with minimal
wear thanks to regen.
It's not the cost of the pads that I'd be concerned about, it's the time
and effort involved - EVs are supposed to be largely maintenance free
IMO.

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