[Dave Koller]

Originally Posted by Woodsmith

Another thing that may affect how you add a motor that won't otherwise fit is whether or not you are planning on keeping the flywheel and clutch.

If no flywheel/clutch then you can use the space in the bell housing for the gears, pulleys, cv joints or what ever you feel is the best option for you.

Good point Wood - are you planning on clutch?

[Dave Koller]

My thought was that you mounted a bearing in the adapter plate to take the side torque off the shaft - come out there and have the CV joint as close to the plate (and bearing) as you can and ANGLE UP and to the front with the motor.

Mounting is not too hard from there. the CV shaft could be machined to fit the spline... Would be an unusual motor mount but maybe not impossible. make a mock up of cardboard and see what ya got .....

[gdirwin]

I was planning on keeping the clutch - I like the idea of a mechanical safety/off switch (in addition to an electrical breaker) for DC runaway scenarios, plus easier gear changes...

I gave up on the direct drive idea - would consider this with an AC motor only (higher usable rpm range) - I don't think DC motors like operating at low speeds in the city. It is a 4.562:1 rear diff ratio though (unusually high)... I would loose AWD with this too (there is snow on the ground 5-6 months of the year around here).

I like the twin motor and CV ideas - there is not much room below as there is a frame member (which probably could be moved/lowered). I had the 36x24 area above the motor/transmission pegged for batteries.

I will pull the diff cover plate and see what it looks like - it looks quite thick from the outside, so will see how much grinding I get away with. Also good idea to shave the motor itself (although my warranty would be toasted likely).

On the bright side, sure glad I waited until the motor was pulled before ordering batteries, motor and controller - they are all linked together. Definitely recommended for transverse AWD builds...

[Woodsmith]

Mock up two 8" motors using manufacturers specs and see if you can fit them both flat at the bottom of the engine bay.
One would line up with the transmission and the other will be to the front to just clear the crossmember.
Being only 8" will leave you the space above for the battery pack.


I am exerting a vested interest as I have been thinking of this for the MR2. Plenty of space below for a cheap twin motor set up if I can't get a cheap 11".

[Thaniel]

Originally Posted by gdirwin

Thanks Dave - I see you have been there - done that. I will plan to keep the ECM and tach as-is - hopefully I can add the stock crank sensor and toothed wheel to the rear shaft, and it will all work...

gdirwin, your new controller (at least zilla) will want to know the RPM of the electric motor. Just like the gas ECU did excpet in the case of zilla it wants a 4 pulls per rev. The zilla can feed tach output. So unless this vehicle has a can bus and it doesn't sound like it does since you talk of OBDII the ECU is just going to get in the way. Zilla controllers also integrate into the check engine light and Battery light. Having 2 controllers (the ICE ECU and new controller) just will be a headache in my opinion.

Oh on your clearance issue with the diff. I'd go with dimple/shave the diff cover and a warp9. The complexity of the dual motors I do not believe worth it. I know you want a quick car but unless you are building a dragster I think the single warp9 will be enough. And yes the drawing on the warp9 states 9.25" for diameter. One thing to consider is how much torque can your clutch even hold. no use hooking up a huge electric motor to a clutch that can only hold 200-300 ft lbs of torque. Besides if you dump to much torque into this car you're likely to start breaking differentials and transmissions.....What's the factory peak torque for the ICE?

Edit: went to measure my warp9 but my calipers only go to 6". Oh and if your vehicle is Can bus then everything I have said is meaning less

[gdirwin]

Thanks Thaniel, Dave, Jim, Rob and all - great ideas and advice. It is great to get help on these issues from people who have been through this.

The stock 2.0L engine has 148 HP, 142 ft-lbs at 6000 rpm.

I also think it is better to keep it simple. The diff cover of concern has some thickness which can be shaved - also worst case there is some clearance behind the cover so a custom/thin metal cover could also be whipped together as Plan B. The Warp9 should fit (perhaps with some "persuasion"/grinding). It will not be a rocket, but I am sure I will not be disappointed.

Thaniel - you are bang-on that the Zilla will also need a speed input (for over-speed control) and can drive the tach - I have not considered this yet - it does not make sense to have 2 tach sensors/circuits...

I will add a pulley onto the end shaft (for the A/C) and hopefully can add the tach sensor for the Zilla onto the end too (and use the Zilla output to drive the tach)... If the ABS brakes, A/C, or airbags do not work (hopefully the ECU wires for these signals are only for diagnostics) then I can weld the 36 tooth wheel, stock CPS sensor and re-enable the ECU to work in parallel. I am still waiting for the factory wiring diagram/manual to arrive (so far relying on Haynes manual - not so good) so maybe can learn more shortly.


So, Warp9 it is. Also a Zilla 1K is the most likely contender (although hoping to avoid liquid cooling).

I will post plans for the motor, batteries, controller etc... shortly... Now that a "low" voltage for the Warp9 is enforced, this will also input into the battery decision.

All other inputs appreciated - thanks all!

[Thaniel]

Originally Posted by gdirwin

So, Warp9 it is. Also a Zilla 1K is the most likely contender (although hoping to avoid liquid cooling).

I will post plans for the motor, batteries, controller etc... shortly... Now that a "low" voltage for the Warp9 is enforced, this will also input into the battery decision.

The question of voltage brings up a question to my mind. Does the battery max voltage HAVE to match the motor max voltage? I believe the zilla (and maybe others) can limit the max current to the motor and looking at the manual maybe even the max voltage? No expert here. Just talking out loud. I'll have to do some research. If that's the case it may change some of my plans on batteries slightly.

I wasn't a big fan of liquid cooling either. However after reading about so many people having controler overheating problems water cooling may work out for the best. Currently I'm looking at using a water cooling system that people use to liquid cool home PC's. People liquid cool their home PC (for high performance) and we want to air cool our computer/controller for our EV.... Just a thought.

[gdirwin]

Now that the ICE is out and I know how big of a motor will fit, this guides everything else...

So, here's "THE PLAN":
- Motor: Netgain Warp 9
- Controller: Zilla Z1K HV
- Batteries: 50 TS200AH LFP batteries
- DC/DC converter: IOTA DLS-90
- Charger: Manzanita PFC20
- Interior Heat: 2x1500W Ceramic heaters
- Power Steering: MR2 electric power steering pump
- Brakes: 12V power brake vacuum booster

More details on each of these (and some factors of each decision) is in separate thread/posts below.

[gdirwin]

THE PLAN - Overall Front Layout:
--------------------------------
- PS pump in bottom middle (near to the PS rack) attached to the belly pan
- Controller and charger mounted in the very front (where the original radiator and fans are)
- Brake booster at front driver side (far away from the cab)
- A/C pump in original location (passenger front, low) and mounted to motor
- DC/DC converter (not sure yet - hopefully room in bottom passenger side close to the 12V battery)
- Batteries on top of everything else (hopefully room to access the controller and DC/DC).
- Other wiring (relays, etc..) - not sure yet, probably hanging off front
- full belly pan (plastic of some sort?) to keep water out
- air handling/routing (to get air flow across batteries in summer).

[gdirwin]

THE PLAN - Motor:
-----------------
Netgain Warp 9
- this will be tight (9.25" diameter)
- no room for anything bigger (probably have to shave 1/16" from somewhere
- backup plan is for a Kostov 9 (8.66" diameter)

I will keep the clutch, so a taper-lock bush and hub will have to be machined (not my expertise - I will find a machinist to do this). The inside of the hub also has to be drilled for a end-bushing (for the transmission shaft to ride in).

The "critical distance" (flywheel face to engine-transmission joint) is 1.30".