[lowcrawler]

Lowcrowler, have you tried GBS cells? I think you should, they are lighter, more powerful and still performs even after passing declared Ah’s… Hm… plus they look nice, have lower volume and comes with connectors…

You clearly missed the point of my post...

[EVfun]

Originally Posted by JRP3

All this poll really shows is that more people have bought TS cells than any other.

I'm pretty sure that is the right answer. However, "Thunder Sky" does't exist anymore. The Yttrium doped cells are now sold by Winston Battery and the other half of what used to be Thunder Sky is now called Sinopoly. I'm not aware of anyone using the Sinopoly cells in an EV yet. My ThunderSky cells dated February 2010 and I believe these are the same as the current Winston cells (LiFeYPO4.) Many have used CALB cells with great success.

CALB cells seem to come with the best cell level documentation. I think most buyers get a sheet with the capacity and internal resistance of each cell. The published data documentation for these cells only show discharge data for up to 1C discharge rates. CALB makes a 70 amp hour cell in the same size as my older TS 60 amp hour cells.

Winston cells seem to be the same as the LYP Thunder Sky cells. In fact, they still have the same part numbers. Winston publishes data for up to 5C discharge rates, like Thunder Sky used to. My TS cells are marked as LFP60AHA but my documentation indicates they re the Yttrium doped cells like the later LYP cells. I know they can take 7C peak discharge rates while holding at about 2.7 vpc.

Sinopoly seems to be the newest cell for the EV garage. I would like to hear from anyone using these cells. I do like the fact that they make a 60 amp hour cell with the same width and depth as what used to be the standard 60 amp hour size from CALB and TS. The new 60 amp hour Sinopoly cell is 0.8 inch shorter and lighter than the old 60 amp hour cells (including the TS ones I have.)

[JRP3]

Don't forget that Jack Rickard did real world testing on TS and CALB cells that showed CALB's to a bit stiffer under load:
http://jackrickard.blogspot.com/2009...tage-more.html

[EVfun]

Yes, but I wouldn't necessarily rely on comparison of cells that where built in 2009. The Sky Energy (CALB) cells date from August 2009 and the Thunder Sky cells from some point earlier in the year of perhaps even 2008. The cells from both manufacturers seem to have improved over the years.

Rich Rudman over at Manzanita Micro could tell me the same thing based on his older testing. I don't know of any side by side tests involving cells recent cells to see how the newer TS cells (LiFeYPO4) compare to current CALB offerings.

I know that 2010 Yttrium doped 60 amp hour Thunder Sky cells stay over 2.8 volts per cell at 5C discharge rates until pretty close to dead. I use them at up to 7.5 C now but I did a repeated tests at that point before I started cranking up my rates. I really wish someone had test results from nearly new CALB 70 amp hour cells as I could drop them in place of my 60 amp hour TS cells. If the real internal resistance at 5C + rates is 1 milliohm or less, that means over 2.9 vpc at 350 amps, it would be tempting. I don't have any brand loyalty.

[JRP3]

Didn't Jack also do a more recent, higher C rate test of CALB's?

[elfi]

Lowcrawler; My point is that both CALB and Winston/Sinopoly have much more disadvantages than GBS for example, no matter application, plus GBS performs fully -20*C to +50*C…

Yabert; my job is in the R&D for worlds Nr.2 forklift manufacturer and abusing materials in order to found suitable is a part of everyday job. I can probably write a book about the EV’s and batteries but so much time I do not have right now. I can also say that according to my excessive abuse those batteries that are high listed and most used in this thread have lowest performance ability and stability… please do not ask for more details, and thanks for understanding…

[lowcrawler]

Again, you clearly missed my point.

[EVfun]

Please explain the advantage of the GBS cells. All the options seem to have the ability to handle continuous 3C discharges. The cells seem to be nearly the same size and weight at the other companies offerings. Even the voltage sag under load doesn't seem any better.

If I was buying right now I would most likely buy CALB cells due to consistent availability, and an extra 10 amps hours as the 70 ah cell is the same size as the older 60 amp hour cells. Each 4 cell block, with end plates added, would measure 10.4 inches by 4.5 inches, by 8 inches tall and weigh 23.5 lb. with end plates and straps (according to the current published information.) That is slightly smaller than a 4 cell block of GBS 60 amp hour cells and just 3.2 lb. heavier for an extra 10 amp hours.

[MN Driver]

Originally Posted by elfi

My point is that both CALB and Winston/Sinopoly have much more disadvantages than GBS for example, no matter application, plus GBS performs fully -20*C to +50*C…

You'll have to explain the 'much more disadvantages'. I could say that walking to my neighbors house has 'much more disadvantages' to getting in my car and pulling into their driveway, but saying that doesn't mean anything unless you describe those disadvantages because walking would be easier and quicker.

You'll have to demonstrate 'GBS performs fully -20*C' I'd love to see a 3C chart compared to one at 20c and show the cold temperature cell performing 'fully'. ...not going to happen.

I can also say that according to my excessive abuse those batteries that are high listed and most used in this thread have lowest performance ability and stability… please do not ask for more details, and thanks for understanding…

You say something and imply an extremely high order to what you are saying, you provide no facts such as voltage sag at a specific current or anything of any real substance to assist someone with making a fact based decision and say 'please do not ask for more details'. All you've done, as far as I'm concerned is say, 'GBS is best manufacturer #1 in all the land, #1 sales, #1 customer happy' just as a Chinese battery manufacturer would without backing anything up. If they were priced similarly or if I found any advantage to them I'd probably think about it but so far their price is far out of reach and to no significant advantage that I can see and none that you've provided.

[elfi]

I am really sorry, no graphs and no official document just a word of someone who had opportunity to play with many different batteries… and why stock to a word GBS in the sentence. If you are asking me I say No GBS is not the best, nor the Thudersky and certainly not CALB… Sorry, I do not intend to spread advertisement towards some products or manufacturers. I am just pointing in the other direction, towards some other products that are not included in this list. Anyway, before buying next time try something else like GBS or Saft or Zebra and see for yourself…
This is one of the testing toys:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whD3574H6Ls