[VOLKSWAGNER420]

EVFun, Thanks again, that will work great and one ought to do it, even in a vert as I am from the north and this is the south. I was thinking about overdoing the battery heaters and running a vent with a fan off of them. Do Lithium batterys put of fumes when charging and discharging?

[Ziggythewiz]

Not under normal conditions. If lithium is venting you've done something very bad.

How south are you?

[EVfun]

Ziggy covered the battery question, but I have one more question.

What kind of performance are you looking for? Your performance will be influenced much more by battery and Controller Selection than by motor selection. Power (in watts) is volts time amps. 746 watt is 1 horsepower but since motors are less than 100% efficient it will take a few more watts per shaft horsepower. You are proposing a 144 volt 500 amp controller and accounting for battery sag under load perhaps 135 volts at 500 amps. That is 67,500 watts, or about 75 shaft horsepower.

[Tesseract]

Originally Posted by VOLKSWAGNER420

.
Controller: DIY kit made by me, Rated for 144V and 500A designed and sold by Paul and Subrina’s EV stuff at http://www.paulandsabrinasevstuff.com/store/page3.html for $600
...
Pot Box Throttle EV Controller: Sold by ECPC at http://www.lithium-battery-division-...ent_p_100.html for $160...

I don't know that an Evnetics throttle will work with a P&S controller. I'd recommended using whatever "pot box" their controller was designed to use instead.

Originally Posted by Tesseract

I don't know that an Evnetics throttle will work with a P&S controller. I'd recommended using whatever "pot box" their controller was designed to use instead.

I tried mine with a curtis clone and it did not like it. The problem is that the pot is not set at zero when closed and the controller wants it to be at zero. The controller has no way to change that function so it won't work. I got it to work by shorting out the leads first and that got the controller fooled so it would start but because it was not set to zero it would run more like an idle. At that point I could run it up and down the street but I always had an idle. I went ahead and did that just to test and I do suspect that the P&S controller is more like that. My Synkromotive controller will handle that issue quite well as I must calibrate what ever pot I have connected. Works perfect with my Synkromotive controller. Works well with the Kelly controller too as the Kelly can be set to above zero threshold. If the P&S controller can be set to above zero then it should work just fine.

Pete

[VOLKSWAGNER420]

EVfun, the 75 HP you are talking about is still three times what came in it so that will do. I just look at it like this. Have you ever went flying past a slow ass car and thought to yourself "I want one of those"? Orr is it the ones that fly past you that you covet? I want to send a positive message about the performance possibility's of an EV while still having around 80-100 mile range.....Lots of Lithium. I was thinking of going with 54 of the 3.3V 100Ah Lithium battery's. My bug WILL be heavy. Will this do it for me or would I need the 160Ah. Also how far % wise, can you safely drain lithium without killing it off sooner then it should go?
Tesseract, A VERY good point, I will e-mail Paul and ask him about that POT control.
Ziggy, I have also asked him about the "Above Zero" thing on the controller (I think I get it) can you explain that further to me? I will have to just live with it if not as his controller is saving me enough cash to upgrade to Lithium.
Thanks to you ALL for your expertise! Keep it coming! What do you wish you would have done differently on your EV's?

[Ziggythewiz]

Most LiFePo4 lithiums will give 2000 cycles at 80% DOD and 3000 at 70% DOD.

You'll probably need at least 200 AH cells for the range you want. Check with corbin to see what his wh/mile is at 75 on hwy.

Really a bug is an awesome choice for an easy around town conversion. For a long range hwy commuter you might want to look into more aerodynamic options.

Most controllers have a pedal down safety check to make sure they don't turn on while you accidently have the pedal down, so if the signal is not 0 or sufficiently close to it, they will refuse to turn on. P&S I think is fully programmable, so it shouldn't be an issue, or you can just go with a cheaper 0-5K pot.

[lowcrawler]

Luckily, it looks like someone already built exactly what you are looking to do:

http://www.corbinstreehouse.com/blog.../electric-bug/

He did a GREAT conversion... a model for mine and others.

Personally, I think your 11" WarP is a bit overkill (ie: the money could be better spend elsewhere). I've got a 9" WarP in my 1970 PlugBug and it fits with slight apron trimming (trim hidden with hood closed) and has considerably more power than stock (I've only got a Soliton Jr and at 150v I'm topped out at about 120hp... but that power is available instantly and will push you in your seat nicely).
An 11 would require quite a lot more (to the point you could see it even with the 'hood' down) trimming and I'm not sure where the benefit would be given your 'power' comes from your controller and your batteries considerably more than from the motor and the 9" isn't the limiting factor in this case.

[EVfun]

Originally Posted by VOLKSWAGNER420

EVfun, the 75 HP you are talking about is still three times what came in it so that will do. I just look at it like this. Have you ever went flying past a slow ass car and thought to yourself "I want one of those"? Orr is it the ones that fly past you that you covet? I want to send a positive message about the performance possibility's of an EV while still having around 80-100 mile range.....Lots of Lithium. I was thinking of going with 54 of the 3.3V 100Ah Lithium battery's. My bug WILL be heavy. Will this do it for me or would I need the 160Ah. Also how far % wise, can you safely drain lithium without killing it off sooner then it should go?

You are describing a battery pack that can routinely put about 80-85 horsepower to the ground. The stock duel port 1584cc Bug engine with single barrel 34 PICT carb only makes 48 to 49 actual horsepower (tested repeatedly by both major US VW rags.) Your performance will be fine, though you won't be setting track records. After all, the car you are starting with (and I've driven more than a few) is noted for having the 1/4 mile time and the 0-60 mph time be nearly the same.

I estimate your range would be about 70 miles with the 100 amp hour pack. You can safely use most of your range. There seems to be little degradation from deep discharges, though reversing a cell instantly destroys it. The ragged upper edge of 100% charged seems to be harder on them. They will start to sag a bit more after they are about 80% discharged.

You really don't want to put a 54 cell pack to a 144 volt motor controller. Usually 45 to 48 cells would be considered the upper limit. Controllers don't respond well to excessive voltage. Usually they work fine for a few extra volts and with a few more they just blow up. The more high end controllers, like the Soliton and Zilla, try their best to protect themselves from excess voltage by refusing to pull in the main contactor and/or refusing to supply any any power to the motor.

[lowcrawler]

Originally Posted by EVfun

I estimate your range would be about 70 miles with the 100 amp hour pack.

That seems a little rose-colored, no?

Even with 54 100Ah cells that's still just a 17.2kwh pack. At 300w/mile that's only 57 miles... and that is 100% DoD... not 80% or 70%.

Corbin (linked above) uses 48 200Ah cells in his bug and gives himself an 80 mile range w/ buffer. Here is the post he talks about that after 3000 miles of driving. Granted Corbin is driving up a massive hill at 65mph for a chunk of that drive... but still. Better to under-estimate your range than to over...eh?

If I needed 100 miles I'd go with nothing less than 60 (192v) 200Ah cells. That's about 900lbs of lithium... which is roughly the max you'd want to put in a Bug. (~1700lbs after engine removal, max gvwr of 2600 [I could be mis-remembering] )