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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Sky Cloud Photograph Vehicle Light
Sky Aircraft Aviation Bell boeing v-22 osprey Aerospace manufacturer
Sky Automotive tire Motor vehicle Vehicle Automotive design


This is a new form to discuss where is the world is going in the Next 50 years pertaining to the skies and Air Traffic.

In todays fast paced world of chaos, confusion, traffic jams, and heavy traffic both on the highway, lets consider this all merging in the air and on the ground. Who is going to monitor all of this control this or police this. This thread is being opened for a friendly approach to this new situation. Almost every country is in the process of developing their own version of the Jetson private electric car. to have theirs ready to go Sweden is almost ready to go. Starting at 92 K is pretty hefty but they have plenty of back orders at this time from California to Europe the first 12 are already ordered.
Drones have already created problems for Air Traffic, The FAA is constantly changing the rule and regulation in that area. Drones are not toys although it is easy to confuse this situation. Every Christmas thousands of drones are sold for the personal enjoyment of the consumer. How many of those do not realize to legally operate one in the United States you need to be licesed tested and regulated with the rest of the avaition traffic to safeguard the lives of everyone concerned.
Now how are we going to merge Airplanes, drones, and flying cars coming and going, landing and taking off with hundreds and thousands of all of these operating anywhere in the world. This is the basis for this form now Who is going to be the first to jump in start talking. Lets have some open friendly conversation here no right or wrong answers here.
From the Colorado High Country
thank you, Hank
 

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Not going to happen for anybody but those already using helicopters to commute to work. This is a 1%er's problem -- people who already have excessively large carbon footprints.

This planet is doomed if we encourage shitty forms of transportation for the masses, like drone-based aviation, where huge amounts of scarce energy are used to merely establish an altitude (fixed wing at least recruits potential energy and can glide). Responsible and ethical engineering practice means saying no to the morons who push this crap.

I also don't see any flying cars in your pictures. Most people can't drive in 2D, let alone 3D.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Not going to happen for anybody but those already using helicopters to commute to work. This is a 1%er's problem -- people who already have excessively large carbon footprints.

This planet is doomed if we encourage shitty forms of transportation for the masses, like drone-based aviation, where huge amounts of scarce energy are used to merely establish an altitude (fixed wing at least recruits potential energy and can glide). Responsible and ethical engineering practice means saying no to the morons who push this crap.

I also don't see any flying cars in your pictures. Most people can't drive in 2D, let alone 3D.
The third picture is a Jetson electric flying car from Sweden single seat 92k. Thank you for your input you are the first one to respond, have a great day and evening. Let's see where we go from here.
Hank
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Can you imagine 100,000 of these flying over head in a given day of you live in the metro. Watch enjoy the video, I am awaiting your reply and your opinion.
Hank


 

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There, now I agree with everything you wrote...

This planet is doomed if we encourage shitty forms of transportation for the masses,
I agree that this sort of thing is an escapist fantasy and will really only be available to the wealthy. If only people got as excited about riding an e-bike as they did about flying a Star Wars speeder-bike then we might have a chance at a future that does not involve everyone slowly broiling. I guess the ultra wealthy might try to jet off to Mars, or build themselves a swanky bunker, but ultimately that is a fantasy too.

Until we can figure out how to run a civilization that is not wildly unsustainable, this sort of thing feels like a distraction.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
There, now I agree with everything you wrote...



I agree that this sort of thing is an escapist fantasy and will really only be available to the wealthy. If only people got as excited about riding an e-bike as they did about flying a Star Wars speeder-bike then we might have a chance at a future that does not involve everyone slowly broiling. I guess the ultra wealthy might try to jet off to Mars, or build themselves a swanky bunker, but ultimately that is a fantasy too.

Until we can figure out how to run a civilization that is not wildly unsustainable, this sort of thing feels like a distraction.
Thank you for your input tonight looks like we have some good feedback going with thread. H Ave a good night Work Safe BE SAFE.
From the Colorado High Country
Thank you,
Hank
 

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It is on my long list of things to build something similar to that Jetson. For fun, and for fabrication practice. There is no way these things will be anything but recreational vehicles, kind of like dune buggies and quads today. Even if we get a breakthrough in battery tech doubling or better tripling the specific energy, there is still the issue of noise - small props are extremely noisy. Now like was stated earlier, electrification for the fixed wing aviation is quite viable, especially for recreational and short-distance commercial. I believe there is a company in Vancouver BC that is currently trying that.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Thanks for your input on this but my vote is not in as far as the useful and practicality that these type of vehicles might achieve towards I know there is aa New York company planning on re-doing the New York Cab system with flying Taxis. I personally live in the high country in Colorado on a hill and plow about two blocks of snow every time we get 2 or more inches on my quad, in the summertime t is used as a workhorse on my .5 acre property for forest projects, gardening projects, and basic home maintenance. So I guess I am not the right guy to discuss the value of a quad with. Yes you are correct in the electric airplane department underway, I believe Cessna has successfully made a working Cessna Caravan electric plane as well as other companies. Here is something I have personally been monitoring for the past five years: Terrafugia Transition if you have time and would like to see something really cool, Google this and report back to me sometime about this.. I will highlight this craft on this Forum but I really would like your opinion on this one.
Thank you again have a great night.
Hank


Sky Snow Slope Larch Tree
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Sky Aircraft Airplane Monoplane Propeller
. More to come about this in a later issue, please enjoy HANK


Here's when New Yorkers might be riding around in electric flying taxis
Joby Aviation made a splash at the NYSE by unveiling an electric aerial ridesharing

Not replacing taxis no, but adding to the nightmare already in new york. Going from Piers and rooftops similar to helicopter service now, easier faster and a whole bunch faster

Enjoy,
HANK
 

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Thanks for your input on this but my vote is not in as far as the useful and practicality that these type of vehicles might achieve towards I know there is aa New York company planning on re-doing the New York Cab system with flying Taxis. I personally live in the high country in Colorado on a hill and plow about two blocks of snow every time we get 2 or more inches on my quad, in the summertime t is used as a workhorse on my .5 acre property for forest projects, gardening projects, and basic home maintenance. So I guess I am not the right guy to discuss the value of a quad with. Yes you are correct in the electric airplane department underway, I believe Cessna has successfully made a working Cessna Caravan electric plane as well as other companies. Here is something I have personally been monitoring for the past five years: Terrafugia Transition if you have time and would like to see something really cool, Google this and report back to me sometime about this.. I will highlight this craft on this Forum but I really would like your opinion on this one.
Thank you again have a great night.
Hank
Are you in the market to build something ? Or perhaps to buy something ? You come across like a person who just had an enlightenment and is eager to spread the gospel. Most of us here have seen this show at least a dozen times already though.
 

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There will be no flying cars. Electric helicopters sure, but not flying cars.

The spinning propellers or whatever needed to lift it off the ground makes it just as noisy and windy as a traditional helicopter, so you won't just land them at work parking lot.

The big disruption I see coming is a large growth in the popularity of home made flying contraptions using drone technology.

I come from the drone/UAV world and the FAA is still playing catch-up. Drones took them by surprise and they had no clue what to do. The same thing will happen with homemade flying contraptions. Some one will build one and fly it to work and cause a huge legal drama.

Autonomous cars, flying cars, and drone delivery are the three things that have pulled in billions and billions of dollars of investment and all they have to show for it is a couple Tesla's driving around jerky as hell and come CGI renderings of drones delivering on rooftops. It's vaporware.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Ok Mr. Electric Land Cruiser,
Here is an example I think, what you were talking about, more or less Homemade and allegedly Autonomous. Hank
SKYCAR® 400
Four passenger VTOL aircraft
Skycar® 400
The Skycar® 400 is the 5th generation of VTOL aircraft developed by Dr. Paul Moller and is now in the “operational prototype” stage. The Skycar® combines the high-speed capabilities of a fixed wing aircraft with the vertical take-off and landing capabilities of a helicopter. Its ducted fans provide lift and propulsion without the dangers of exposed rotor blades and high maintenance costs of rotary-winged aircraft. The vehicle employs state-of-the-art fly-by-wire computer technology to monitor, control, and maintain stability of the aircraft, while simultaneously making it simple and easy to operate.
In the future, passengers will not be required to fly the aircraft, as the Skycar® will be an autonomous aircraft utilizing advanced onboard environment scanning and precise positioning systems, the highway-in-the-sky (HITS) and automated air traffic control in order to fly between destinations and avoid other air-traffic.
Skycar® 400 Targeted Performance

VTOL Configuration Four thrust-vectoring nacelles with two counter-rotating Rotapower® engines per nacelle. Hybrid design configurations are currently under development
Passengers 2+2
Emergency Airframe Parachutes Yes
Fuel Type Ethanol
Noise Level at 500ft (Goal) 65 dBA
Dimensions (L x W x H) 21.5’ x 8.5’ x 7.5’
Operational ceiling 36,000 ft
Takeoff and landing area 35 ft dia
Max speed @sea-level 331 mph
Cruise Max speed @20,000 ft 308 mph
Rate of climb @sea-level 4,800 fpm
Endurance 5.9 hours
Disc loading 140 lb/ft2
Range @ 131 mph (21.3 mpg) 805 miles
Net payload 720 lbs
Gross weight 2,400 lbs
Continuous Engine Power (Total) 720 hp
Maximum Lift/Drag 12.5



Cloud Sky Pink Vehicle Art
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Sky Automotive design Automotive lighting Motor vehicle Wheel
Water Sky Nature Aircraft Cloud
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
How old is the concept of an actual working flying car??? Personally i cannot answer that, but here is an example I am sure many of you are not aware of, Molten Taylor Aerocar made this and sold a few couples in the 1950's. Enjoy the video and please reply.



Hank
 

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Moller's "Skycar" has always been a joke, and Moller has always claimed performance which could not be demonstrated. The big difference between the original of this series of "concepts" and current technology of VTOL craft is the shift from eight (yes, 8) Wankel-type engines to electric motors and a problematically heavy battery.

The idea of putting the word "car" in the name of these vehicles originally suggested that the vehicle can drive on a road or fly, which is always a terrible compromise. More recently, it tends to suggest instead that the vehicle can operate as a transportation appliance operated with a minimally skilled operator, which is a product of automated flight controls and denial of reality by those proposing these operations. In fact, there's nothing about a multicopter that is inherently more "car like" than an automated helicopter.
 

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Ok Mr. Electric Land Cruiser,
Here is an example I think, what you were talking about, more or less Homemade and allegedly Autonomous. Hank
SKYCAR® 400
Four passenger VTOL aircraft
Skycar® 400
The Skycar® 400 is the 5th generation of VTOL aircraft developed by Dr. Paul Moller and is now in the “operational prototype” stage. The Skycar® combines the high-speed capabilities of a fixed wing aircraft with the vertical take-off and landing capabilities of a helicopter. Its ducted fans provide lift and propulsion without the dangers of exposed rotor blades and high maintenance costs of rotary-winged aircraft. The vehicle employs state-of-the-art fly-by-wire computer technology to monitor, control, and maintain stability of the aircraft, while simultaneously making it simple and easy to operate.
In the future, passengers will not be required to fly the aircraft, as the Skycar® will be an autonomous aircraft utilizing advanced onboard environment scanning and precise positioning systems, the highway-in-the-sky (HITS) and automated air traffic control in order to fly between destinations and avoid other air-traffic.
Skycar® 400 Targeted Performance


VTOL Configuration Four thrust-vectoring nacelles with two counter-rotating Rotapower® engines per nacelle. Hybrid design configurations are currently under development
Passengers 2+2
Emergency Airframe Parachutes Yes
Fuel Type Ethanol
Noise Level at 500ft (Goal) 65 dBA
Dimensions (L x W x H) 21.5’ x 8.5’ x 7.5’
Operational ceiling 36,000 ft
Takeoff and landing area 35 ft dia
Max speed @sea-level 331 mph
Cruise Max speed @20,000 ft 308 mph
Rate of climb @sea-level 4,800 fpm
Endurance 5.9 hours
Disc loading 140 lb/ft2
Range @ 131 mph (21.3 mpg) 805 miles
Net payload 720 lbs
Gross weight 2,400 lbs
Continuous Engine Power (Total) 720 hp
Maximum Lift/Drag 12.5



View attachment 129855 View attachment 129856 View attachment 129857 View attachment 129858
65 dBa at 500 feet (goal)

Yeah 👍 take that to work at 6AM see how it works out 😂
 

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Exactly! There hasn't been a breakthrough in 70 years even with pretty advanced combustion engines of the 2000's, but somehow electrics (quarter energy density if not less) will make it work ? What's the logic here ?
Ease of control and mechanical simplicity. A separate motor for each rotor of a multi-rotor aircraft (such as a quad-rotor or "quadcopter", the most common design for toys of this type) is easy to control, and with electric motors doesn't require complex mechanical systems to drive all those rotors from one engine while delivering different thrust from each one. That makes it easy for any nutjob to propose a "flying car" that would have been even less plausible with an engine.

As a kid in school I remember making a papier-mâché model inspired by the Bell X-22 of the 1960's (which was recent history then!). The X-22 had ten gearboxes to interconnect four engines and four fans, with variable pitch on each fan for control. A Skycar is essentially a small version of the same thing but with separate engines for each fan (instead of interconnected), and anything recent with a couple of fans on each side is the same idea again, but now with electric motors so a school kid can actually build one.

A recently publicized project (Flowcopter) is building a quad-rotor autonomous aircraft with an engine driving the rotors through a hydrostatic system (pump on engine, a hydraulic motor per rotor, and control valves) to achieve the same control and lack of mechanical complication as electric multi-rotors, without the power electronics (or battery). This company acknowledges the endurance issue with battery-electric aircraft, especially in aircraft using rotors for lift, which are less efficient than fixed-wing aircraft.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Ease of control and mechanical simplicity. A separate motor for each rotor of a multi-rotor aircraft (such as a quad-rotor or "quadcopter", the most common design for toys of this type) is easy to control, and with electric motors doesn't require complex mechanical systems to drive all those rotors from one engine while delivering different thrust from each one. That makes it easy for any nutjob to propose a "flying car" that would have been even less plausible with an engine.

As a kid in school I remember making a papier-mâché model inspired by the Bell X-22 of the 1960's (which was recent history then!). The X-22 had ten gearboxes to interconnect four engines and four fans, with variable pitch on each fan for control. A Skycar is essentially a small version of the same thing but with separate engines for each fan (instead of interconnected), and anything recent with a couple of fans on each side is the same idea again, but now with electric motors so a school kid can actually build one.

A recently publicized project (Flowcopter) is building a quad-rotor autonomous aircraft with an engine driving the rotors through a hydrostatic system (pump on engine, a hydraulic motor per rotor, and control valves) to achieve the same control and lack of mechanical complication as electric multi-rotors, without the power electronics (or battery). This company acknowledges the endurance issue with battery-electric aircraft, especially in aircraft using rotors for lift, which are less efficient than fixed-wing aircraft.
I'm just not so sure Flowcopter do t think that IA going to work. Thank you for your input, have a great night.
Hank
 
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