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Discussion Starter #1
Hello wise folk,



I have a Hyper 9 low-voltage system with an AC1 controller, and I intend to fit these plus 5 Tesla modules to my Beetle.



I bought a chill plate with the controller which will obviously only be used when the motor is running.


I am aware the Tesla modules should be kept cool-ish, and at least at an even temperature to avoid hot spots. I am also aware that Li batteries don't like to be charged when cold.



I was intending to have one coolant circuit for the controller, and another for the batteries (which would need an in-line heating element when charging in the cold) but I'm wondering about combining the two circuits so as to only have one pump.


Anybody got any thoughts on this? Having two separate circuits with two pumps has its pros and cons - more to go wrong, but perhaps less complex than combining the two. In winter, heating the coolant whilst charging would also heat up the controller chill plate if i do combine them, which is not efficient but perhaps not problematic as charge is not coming from the batteries, and once the car is running the controller heat would heat them.



Many thanks.
 

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Hello wise folk,



I have a Hyper 9 low-voltage system with an AC1 controller, and I intend to fit these plus 5 Tesla modules to my Beetle.



I bought a chill plate with the controller which will obviously only be used when the motor is running.


I am aware the Tesla modules should be kept cool-ish, and at least at an even temperature to avoid hot spots. I am also aware that Li batteries don't like to be charged when cold.



I was intending to have one coolant circuit for the controller, and another for the batteries (which would need an in-line heating element when charging in the cold) but I'm wondering about combining the two circuits so as to only have one pump.


Anybody got any thoughts on this? Having two separate circuits with two pumps has its pros and cons - more to go wrong, but perhaps less complex than combining the two. In winter, heating the coolant whilst charging would also heat up the controller chill plate if i do combine them, which is not efficient but perhaps not problematic as charge is not coming from the batteries, and once the car is running the controller heat would heat them.



Many thanks.
I’m getting ready to do a 59’ fiat 1100 conversion for my client, ac-51 motor from HPEVS and 5 Tesla modules, so similar boat as you.

There’s lots of ways to approach this “issue”, and multiple correct ways. I’m going to first build a little coolant temp monitor system, so that it can trigger an in-line fluid heater. No, not the weak ones from EV west that are 12V and like 200w or whatever. I’m going to use an inline heater that’s like 2000-3000 watts (yes they exist) that run on high voltage. If I can’t find that though, I will get cheap high voltage immersive heating elements and put that in the coolant reservoir.

Soo, Tesla modules like to be above 41F I believe when charged, so the goal with the 2kW fluid heater is that it only takes a minute or so to heat the batteries to a good temp. I live in Texas, so cold isn’t that much of a problem but it frequently goes into 30s in winter though, but regardless the system will work either way. The batteries can be discharged in the cold, much less restriction, but a slight power loss, so if you want to avoid the power loss, then preheat them slightly as mentioned above. And of course that preheating is mandatory when charging is initiated.

To your question specifically, I’m going to preheat the batteries and yes, it will preheat the controller some. My goal is to just heat the batteries to about 50F, and then I’ll let the internal heat of batteries and controller heat go from there and have the heating system turned off. This reduces the complicity and dumbing a bit of heat into the controller heatsink won’t do any harm or get it “hot” so to speak.

That’s just my current setup I’m probably going to do. NOTE!! You MUST have water manifolds on your Tesla modules. This means input water goes into the manifold, and gets split into 5 fluid lines and inputs the module, and then 5 fluid lines all come out and return into another manifold. This ensures even module temps, and if you don’t have these you’ll have major differences in temps, especially when preheating and will eventually cause imbalance.

Hopefully that clears up what you were asking! Let me know if you have other questions.

Also, what bms and charger are you using?? BMS is so very important with Tesla modules, as thermal management is critical.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Hi, thanks for that.



I'm using an Orion BMS2, which seems very capable, but progress is very slow for me as I have a day job which eats almost all my time.


Have you used one of these with the Hyper9 setup yet? I am told that Netgain are releasing a firmware upgrade so that the Orion can limit current discharge via CAN - something I just assumed would work 'out of the box'.
 

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Hi, thanks for that.



I'm using an Orion BMS2, which seems very capable, but progress is very slow for me as I have a day job which eats almost all my time.


Have you used one of these with the Hyper9 setup yet? I am told that Netgain are releasing a firmware upgrade so that the Orion can limit current discharge via CAN - something I just assumed would work 'out of the box'.
No problem. Funny you mention that as I just spoke to my contacts at Orion yesterday about that. HPEVS has complete can support currently, but i was told the guys at netgain are working to get the firmware to support the Orion, and once they do, Orion will make sure there’s full support for it. That’s what I was told anyhow.
 

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And the charge is an Elcon clone, 6.6KW CAN-enabled.
So the charger is a TC/elcon Can bus charger? If so you should be able to hook it to the can network, and simply select “elcon/tc charger” in can settings in Orion battery profile, should merely work out of the box.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I believe the charger should work fine with the Orion over CAN, my fear was being able to control regen and discharge rates in the X1 controller via CAN.



I am planning to use Charge Enable and Discharge Enable (from the Orion) to close a contactor which would complete the battery -motor circuit. In that way, if the Orion decides that the pack cannot accept any charge (from regen) it can open the contactor if the CAN messages to the X1 are ignored.
 

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I believe the charger should work fine with the Orion over CAN, my fear was being able to control regen and discharge rates in the X1 controller via CAN.



I am planning to use Charge Enable and Discharge Enable (from the Orion) to close a contactor which would complete the battery -motor circuit. In that way, if the Orion decides that the pack cannot accept any charge (from regen) it can open the contactor if the CAN messages to the X1 are ignored.
Sounds like a good plan as far as I can think of. Once the engineers at netgain finish tweaking their CAN info, they’ll collaborate with the engineers at Orion and get excellent functionality put in place over CAN.

Shouldn’t be too much longer I would hope
 

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I believe the charger should work fine with the Orion over CAN, my fear was being able to control regen and discharge rates in the X1 controller via CAN.



I am planning to use Charge Enable and Discharge Enable (from the Orion) to close a contactor which would complete the battery -motor circuit. In that way, if the Orion decides that the pack cannot accept any charge (from regen) it can open the contactor if the CAN messages to the X1 are ignored.
And do you have your Tesla modules yet?
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Yes, I got five modules from a P100D, so the higher energy density version (6.4KWh vs 5.2KWh). My provisional plan is to mount 2 up front, and 3 behind the rear seats, although I'd prefer to keep them all together if possible.
 

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Yes, I got five modules from a P100D, so the higher energy density version (6.4KWh vs 5.2KWh). My provisional plan is to mount 2 up front, and 3 behind the rear seats, although I'd prefer to keep them all together if possible.
If I were you I’d try to keep them all together, it’ll make BMS wiring much easier, especially because Orion BMS has issues if you spread pack out unless you have extra cell groups.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Yes, I realised that after I bought the 36 cell version!


I think I will probably put an isolator between the packs, and I'll just have to remember to disconnect the Orion before I turn off the disconnect.
 

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Yes, I realised that after I bought the 36 cell version!


I think I will probably put an isolator between the packs, and I'll just have to remember to disconnect the Orion before I turn off the disconnect.
I would just build the modules all together if you can, make room and they aren’t very big. Stack of two and beside that stack of 3
 
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