Cell pack hybrid scooter no initialisation!

21307 Views 94 Replies 10 Participants Last post by djurica86, 1 mo ago

Josefmifsud1974

Discussion Starter · Sep 29, 2017

Hello friends I hope someone can help me in my dilemma.
I changed the cells in my hybrid scooter battery pack and when im trying to turn on from mosfet switch it remains blinking red.
The battery pack is 10 cells 3.7v at 31Ah.Has and integrated bms and 9 cells have a board between terminals.I removed the pcb chips and installed on the new cells.The bms has a can bus system also which communicates with the main ecu.
But im stuck the voltage is there but the bms is not giving the signal to swith on the battery and turn the led to green.
The battery is installed in the Hybrid scooter MP3 made by Piaggio.
I have more documentation if needed.
Hope I will have some feedback because my hopes are diminishing

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5

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Josefmifsud1974

Discussion Starter · #81 · Oct 20, 2017

More Photos of the ELDOR KUADRO ECU of the hybrid scooter

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2

kennybobby

· #82 · Oct 21, 2017

Well i found one reason why it's not working--the cell monitoring boards are missing some of the connections to the cell tabs. There are 4 solder bridges that complete an exposed trace, two on front and two on back, that connect the + and - pad to the rest of the circuitry. On two of the boards i looked at the (-) or ground bridge was blown off or missing (maybe these function as fuses?). Need to inspect all the boards to verify that these joints and traces are intact, or make repairs. Let us know what you find from the inspection.

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Josefmifsud1974

Discussion Starter · #83 · Oct 21, 2017

Will be cheking all boards for these failures and verify integrity of units.
thanks for your support its good to have your feedback , very well appreciated

Josefmifsud1974

Discussion Starter · #84 · Oct 24, 2017

Hi here is a sketch outlined from our friend Kenny .
A big thankyou for this job well appreciated and hope we will move on with this project.

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Josefmifsud1974

Discussion Starter · #85 · Oct 24, 2017

Josefmifsud1974 said:
Hi here is a sketch outlined from our friend Kenny .
A big thankyou for this job well appreciated and hope we will move on with this project.

This is a pcb/bms which is found on every cell in the battery pack, which communicates with the main bms and sends data on each cell.

Josefmifsud1974

Discussion Starter · #86 · Oct 28, 2017

Hi we managed to pin out the pcb boards which are on each cell
and the terminal pins are serial bus communication lines tx,rx
Is there a way to get the data what is being transmitted from the chip with arduino???

Solarsail

· #87 · Oct 28, 2017

Josefmifsud1974 said:
Hi we managed to pin out the pcb boards which are on each cell
and the terminal pins are serial bus communication lines tx,rx
Is there a way to get the data what is being transmitted from the chip with arduino???

The schematic is very useful. Thanks. I wonder if D1 is a zener diode?

I don't have the experience - but I am sure you could use a digital analyzer or arduino probe to sniff the packets. Then start from the top (or bottom) balancer board and go down one by one, and see which one is negatively altering the packet, or transmitting an error condition. But then what? If the problem is the MC on the balance board, how are you going to fix that? Hard to believe that bridge solder was missing - then why did it use to work?

If you are going to sniff and spoof, might as well sniff the main battery terminal controller to the ECU, so you can replace the battery pack altogether.

Does the bike normally work in pure electric mode? If so, then get rid of everything except the motor, and put in a 5 kWh pack, and you are flying.

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Drrossio

· #88 · Mar 29, 2019

Hi guys is this thread still active ?
Did someone found a solution ?

Cheers Alain

kennybobby

· #89 · Mar 29, 2019

i think Q5 is used for cell balancing thru the 33R resistor.

Is it possible to download or read the firmware for an ATMEGA48PV?

Max71

· #90 · May 4, 2020

Hello, i recently got some Piaggio Liberty Email and it seems the system is similar if not the same with just different software. I did also not sniff the can bus yet but i hope to do that in some days, as a special cable is needed and my can analyser is not here yet. I have a Piaggio Navigator and i have a software button to reprogramm the BMS, i am almost sure it will not work but first i need the cable 020878Y and can sniffer tools.

Is there some process? i am really fascinated about "old" Piaggio Electric/Hybrid tech, it had a ton of problems but i hope to fix this, in the email there are 2 batteries with 40Ah Kokam cells, so 3kWh in total which should be good for 60 km at 45km/h. I have alot of disarmed batteries with only 24-27V, guess they are dead but i need to find it out, of all cells would have equal voltage( which for sure is not the case) they could survive, but main problem will be software...

Also, if batteries cannot be activated or used, it would be cool to make a new battery with suitable can signals to use the original Eldor Kuadro unit.

Somehow i cannot attach pics but small board says 05PGN03BBA000 and the big main PCB is 05PGN03BAB000

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kujtim

· #91 · Dec 6, 2020

Hello friends, I wanted to ask a question about the Piaggio MP3 125cc Hybrid Engine.
I faulty the Hybrid Battery and removed it from the engine,
the engine starts to work with gasoline but does not react throtlet whether there is a possibility of battery connection

please help me if you have had the same problem
Thank you very much

Peter Hem

· #92 · 8 mo ago

kujtim said:
Hello friends, I wanted to ask a question about the Piaggio MP3 125cc Hybrid Engine.
I faulty the Hybrid Battery and removed it from the engine,
the engine starts to work with gasoline but does not react throtlet whether there is a possibility of battery connection

please help me if you have had the same problem
Thank you very much

Ok I have the same problem:. dead hybrid battery .
Without the 37v battery canbus signal it won't drive. ( immobilized throttle )
So does anybody have the canbus files of this battery ? With a canbus emulator that
emulate the battery as ok and 30Vcharge it will run as a normal gasoline scooter .
The charging during driving will be blocked because the voltage is lower than 32V .
normal driving is still possible.

A lot of mp3 scooters are standing still because of this problem . ......
Help us all

Reactions: 1

Sholek

· #93 · 3 mo ago

Hi, I read the whole thread and I don't think the battery problem has been solved, which is a pity. In Poland there is a company https://motoelektronika.pl/ which digitally removes the hybrid drive from the piaggio mp3 from Eldor Kubo 03. I have batteries for mp3 myself and Piaggio Liberty e-mail me, I'm curious if my set will communicate. Regards

kennybobby

· #94 · 3 mo ago

Did any of you guys check for missing solder bridges on the BMS boards? See post #82 for picture and #84 for schematic.

Those of you with the scooter and circuit boards will need to step up this investigation if you want to solve it. i could only trace out the boards that Josef sent me.

djurica86

· #95 · 1 mo ago

Josefmifsud1974 said:
Hello friends I hope someone can help me in my dilemma.
I changed the cells in my hybrid scooter battery pack and when im trying to turn on from mosfet switch it remains blinking red.
The battery pack is 10 cells 3.7v at 31Ah.Has and integrated bms and 9 cells have a board between terminals.I removed the pcb chips and installed on the new cells.The bms has a can bus system also which communicates with the main ecu.
But im stuck the voltage is there but the bms is not giving the signal to swith on the battery and turn the led to green.
The battery is installed in the Hybrid scooter MP3 made by Piaggio.
I have more documentation if needed.
Hope I will have some feedback because my hopes are diminishing

Hi, how did you finally solve a problem with battery?
I'm from Zagreb Croatia and have a similar problem, heard that you have a friend in Croatia who has a knowledge and maybe some solution.

Thanx in advance & BR,
Damir

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