Elcon Charger?

Sunking said:

I have had one. Very good chargers. My only complaint is the user cannot program them. So this makes it very important when you buy one to specify the exact voltage you will need when ordering.

Since you are using LEAF batteries, they use a bit of an odd voltage, and what voltage you use will depend on how many cells you have in series. So make sure you get that part right.

Leaf batteries are 66 AH, and you want to limit charge current to no greater than C/2 or 33 amps. So you could go as high as a 3300 watt Charger if you can afford it. But you might ask yourself do you really need a 2-Hour charge rate before dishing out the cash when a 1500 watt model or C/4 (4-hour rate) still gets the job done.

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Really? I thought that I could change the profile with some software add on. I plan to keep it compact for a motorcycle, I don't plan to change the batteries chems. maybe if I do change it, then i could find out if they are willing change charging profile for a cost. and a 2hr charge time is always good. maybe 3.3kw is the way to go.

but i saw that there are 82 amp hr Leaf cells from newer leafs ==> http://evbatterycenter.com/HAC4/ind...battery-module-500wh-4x-cells-82ah&Itemid=605

I am tempted to go with those 82. though it is almost double the cost of the 66 amp hr cells

Coulomb said:

According to EVAlbum,com, Elcon is the second most used brand of charger for converted EVs, though well behind Zivan and with Manzanita Micro not far behind.

But the 1.8 and 3.3 kW models are rather different to the older models, much more compact for example, so these are a bit of an unknown quantity. I'd be interested to know what's inside them. I'm guessing wide band gap MOSFETs.

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Well, in the weeks to come, I'll be the test mouse, see what happens, and let the forum know. I would be willing to get the 3.3kw(if it fits on a '06 GSX-R). just been saving up cash for it

Hello,
I own an old ELCON-modell with 1,5kW with Enable-control (not the CAN-model). With this old model you can control variable current/power with a 2-5V-signal (i.e. from a microcontroller with PWM + RC).

The new Elcons (small, Alloy-case, with Fan) with 1,8 & 3,3 & 6,6kW could be configured also with Enable-control instead of CAN but there you will get only ON/Off-functionallity !!!
http://www.elconchargers.com/UHF.html

To have variable power control you will definitely need the CAN-Bus model where you can send endvoltage and current with a CAN-message (much more complicated than with the old 2-5V-input-system). But with that you can PROGRAM it by yourself. This makes it very flexible. Only max. endvoltage- and max. current-value of the choosen charger-type are the limits. So I think, you can use a high voltage model also for less cells (only send the suitable endvoltage value by CAN-bus).

I've checked this with different sellers now.
So we start with developing a voltage to CAN-message-converter because we can't get the old ones anymore.
Therefore we will use an AT90CAN128 micro with integrated CAN-hardware. Hope we get it working.

best regards from Germany
umali

"How did that charger turn out for you, Paul? Any update?"

The short answer is that I have not received it yet. I was quoted a 12 day delivery from the payment date. I waited about 18 days and sent them an email asking about a delivery date. They apologised and advised that it had not left the factory yet. As of today (11 July) I have not received it.

A slightly longer answer, to give the manufacturer the benefit of the doubt, is that I actually ordered two 3.3kw chargers but I wanted one of them "dumbed down" to 2.2kw. Here in Aust we have two common circuits, some 10 amps at 240 volts (2400 watts) and some 15 amps at 240 volts (3600 watts). My residence and some of my friends' places have the 3600 watt circuits so I would like to charge at these places using the 3.3kw charger. Some public charging points have only 2400 watt circuits hence the 3.3kw charger would be useless. The 1.8kw charger would be suitable for these circuits but terribly slow so I asked that one of the 3.3kw chargers I ordered be "dumbed down" to 2.2kw which the manufacturer agreed to do.

The delay in delivery may be because it would, I assume, take time to modify the second 3.3kw charger down to 2.2kw.

I will advise as soon as they are received.

Cheers
Paul

Hi people,

I said in a previous post that I would advise when the new 3.3kw chargers arrived. Well, they finally arrived. I ordered and received the non CAN bus versions in case anyone is curious. There is no manual with them so I had to get onto the TC Charger website to download it.

Problem 1 is that the old chargers had an IEC connector on the AC input side and a POS and NEG line on the DC output side. The new chargers have a 4 pin connector on both the AC input side and the DC output side. The 4 pins are marked A, B, C and D and the female connectors (supplied) are also marked A, B, C and D. Ok, I didn't have too many problems up to that point.

I then consulted the manual. For the AC input side, the A pin/hole is for the "Null" line and the B pin/hole is for the "Fire" line. The D pin/hole is for the GND line. Here in Aust the GND is commonly the earth line. However I have never heard of a "Null" line nor a "Fire" line. My assumption is that the Fire line is what I normally call the POSITIVE line and the Null line is what I call the NEGATIVE? I would appreciate someone confirming or denying that assumption!?

Problem 2 is that DC output side in the manual is described as "A.D" is positive and "B.C" is negative. I don't know if that means A OR D is Positive or that A AND D is positive. I assume that "A.D" being the Positive means that I can use either the A or D pin/hole for the positive and either the B or C pin/hole for the negative. Again I would appreciate someone confirming or denying my assumption?!

Problem 3 is that on the female connector the holes are marked A, B, C, and D. The problem is that I can't tell which letter refers to which hole! To best describe the arrangement I would imagine the face of a clock. The holes are at the numbers 3, 6, 9 and 12. The letters are between the numbers 3, 6, 9 and 12. That is the A hole sits between the number 12 and the number 3. So is the A hole referring to 3 on my clock face or the hole at 12 on my clock face?

I haven't even looked at the signal control input output yet.

Any advice much appreciated!
Thanks
Paul

Paul9 said:

I then consulted the manual. For the AC input side, the A pin/hole is for the "Null" line and the B pin/hole is for the "Fire" line. The D pin/hole is for the GND line. Here in Aust the GND is commonly the earth line. However I have never heard of a "Null" line nor a "Fire" line. My assumption is that the Fire line is what I normally call the POSITIVE line and the Null line is what I call the NEGATIVE?

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AC doesn't have positive and negative, dspite what a lot of electricians will tell you (especially in Australia, where many mains cables have red and black for active and neutral respectively, just as you would expect for positive and negative respectively). [ Edit: and I meant to say: I would assume that "null" means neutral (in Australia, light blue or black; note black is hot in the USA and some other places). I would also assume that "fire" is a poor translation of "active" (in Australia, brown or red). ]

Problem 2 is that DC output side in the manual is described as "A.D" is positive and "B.C" is negative. I don't know if that means A OR D is Positive or that A AND D is positive. I assume that "A.D" being the Positive means that I can use either the A or D pin/hole for the positive and either the B or C pin/hole for the negative.

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I would assume that A and D are both connected together, so you could use either, but you may as well use both connected together, to share the current. But it would be a really good idea to check this with a multimeter, with the charger turned off (and not having been turned on for the last minute or several).

Problem 3 is that on the female connector the holes are marked A, B, C, and D. The problem is that I can't tell which letter refers to which hole!

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You should be able to sort that out by checking the earth pin; it should connect to the metal of the charger. Again, use a multimeter to find out which side of the letter is the indicated hole. Amazing and dangerous that they can make this ambiguous!

If you can post some photos of the connectors, preferably close-ups, that would be helpful.

As I promised I thought I would advise progress(?) with the two new 3.3kw chargers I bought.

First problem is that the connectors are 4 pin, pin and socket connectors. The female connectors do not fit snugly onto the male connector - they wobble! Even though they are locked in they still wobble.

Secondly the female lugs that go into the female connector don't stay in. If you turn the female connector upside down and tap it, the lugs (and any wire attached to them), fall out of the connector. These lugs are also very thin. Less than 2mm in diameter. Don't drop them on the garage floor as, if your garage looks like mine, you will never find them. And TC only give you 8 pins in total - no spares.

Thirdly, neither the female connectors nor the lugs that go in them are available in Australia. I have tried some online stores suggested to me by "Coulomb" and they have advised they do not have them.

Fourthly the User Manual is less than clear in regard to which hole in the female connector receives which wire. Emails with "Coulomb" and a number of emails to TC in China have, I think, cleared this up.

As a result of the above I managed to blow one of the connectors up (the DC OUT connector). A loud bang accompanied by a large shower of sparks and melted lugs was the result. Despite being very careful that the right wire went in the right hole, I may have stuffed up my connecting somewhere, so I am not laying all the blame necessarily on the charger. End result is one stuffed $1,000AU charger.

I have been told persistence is a virtue so I got out the other new charger and wired it up without the female connectors and insulated the living daylights out of all the wires. I powered the charger up and it just sat there. The fan didn't spin and no LED lights. But I had achieved something - no explosion! About the same reaction as if I had wired up a house brick.

The old PFC TC Chargers using IEC connectors were just plug and play. The only other thing I have noticed is that the new 3.3kw TC chargers from the USA (based only on photos on their websites) already appear to have wired up the connectors for you and have the wires running out of the connectors so you only have to connect the wires.

I am fully aware than a number of my problems with my EV have been a result of my own stupidity so I took my "good" TC Charger ("good" as in not the one I blew up) over to my electrician brother's place to check my wiring and test the charger. Even though my crimping of wires to lugs was fine, he always likes to solder things, so he rewired all wires with solder.

We then connected up the AC IN as per our understanding of the manual, the DC Out as advised by TC in China, and connected the 12v+ to the enable line as I don't use CAN. He then put a multimeter on the DC out and absolutely no reading. The fan didn't spin and no LED lights showing error messages.

If anyone successfully wires up their new charger I would be extremely interested in how they wired it up!!!

Thanks
Paul

I still plan to buy the charger from here:

http://evcomponents.com/customized-chargers/elcon-tc-hk-h-1800w-charger.html

but what do you put in the parameters for if you are using Nissan leaf cells?

From what was said earlier, the company will program it.

but where my confusion is that Nissan doesn't provide a "nominal" voltage for the cells, only a max voltage of 4.2 volt from what I could find. I am using the 82 ah cells. At max charge, it would be 100.8 volts. And with the way the cells are arranged in Leaf cells would be 24 total Cells. also the chemistry would be just li-ion, right? and as for the AC input I could pick 90vac~256VAC correct living in the US

I just wanted to run by you guys here before i make a move and get with the wrong setting.

Mathis, Will you be using a BMS? If you are then you could have the charger programmed for the max, and then all of your control comes from the BMS. This is what I'm doing for my Chevy Volt cells. I have an Elcon PFC2500 that was programmed for 4.2 * number of cells but I never let the Elcon have control. So it's essentially as close as I can get to a CCCV charger. The BMS has full control of the charging process -- it enables and disables the charger (the Elcon PFC2500 has an enable line) and then I can effectively program my charging through the BMS.

If you don't have a BMS and this kind of control, then I don't know what to say. I did a 2-second google search for "leaf cell nominal" and this was the first hit : https://qnovo.com/inside-the-battery-of-a-nissan-leaf/ Perhaps that will give you some insight. Maybe 3.95v/cell?