[VintageVolts]

Hello,
I'm a long time lurker on this forum, and have started to put together a list of components for my EV Conversion here in the UK. At the moment i'm leaning towards a 144v system with a Hyper9HV motor setup, with the commonly used tesla modules as batteries.

I see lots of info about the wiring of J1772 sockets, but I haven't been able to find anything about Type 2 connectors.

My questions:
1) If i were to buy an Elcon 6.6kW charger i.e. This Elcon TC 6.6kW from Renugen , what hardware (other than cable & conduit!) would i need to connect it up to a Type 2 Socket such as this one? ZeroEV only have a CCS setup for sale which has a minimum DC voltage of 200V as far as i understand, so isn't compatible for my 144v battery setup.

2) If my onboard charger was the 6.6kW one above and then i plug in a 3kW 'granny charger' such as this one , what would happen - would the 6.6kW charger just charge at the maximum power available to it, or simply not charge at all?


I've looked and looked for these answers but i must be missing something. Lots of build videos on youtube skim over this information.

Cheers. I'll put a build thread up once i have a better idea of what i need.
Tom

 

[X19e]

Hello,
it looks like I'm at a similar state of the project as you. The charger looks like an easy part, because it provides all the required signals for the seven pins of the Type 2 connector. Even more, because you can connect LED signals for charging, finished, error messages and the electric cable lock directly to it. See definition of Type 2 for CP and PP signals: Type 2 Wikipedia.
If found this manual on the TC Charger homepage: TC 6.6kW and used deepl.com to translate the complete pdf. Some pages are a bit scrambled, but you can read most of it. Around page 12 you will see a connector with the signals mentioned above.

Best regards
Frank

 

[VintageVolts]

Ah great, thanks! For reference i opened that PDF in Microsoft Word, used the translator built in to that , and have attached an English and a German Version here. It may be useful, maybe not!

 

[X19e]

Thank's a lot for the perfect translated German Version, Tom!
Just to let you know: I plan to use two or three of the 3.3 kW TC chargers instead of one 6.6kW. German energy suppliers don't like it when you stress just one phase with more than 16 A alone. Volkswagen E-Golf owners had a lot of discussions to instal a Wallbox, because of its single phase onboard 7 kW charger. Some public charging points are even set to reject to charge such a car or provide much less current. The reason is, it creates a scew load on the three phase system that has to be compensated with other loads.
Don't know if the situation in UK is similar or you have ever heard about this. US is totally different.

 

[4Foxtrot]

Similar setup here (also UK), with Elcon 6.6Kw charger and Tesla modules (both controlled by simpBMS, which I highly rate as it uses the original Tesla module pcb’s / bleed resistor controllers).

I got an AVC2 from Electric Classic Cars with resistor change to suit UK charger infrastructure. This Works a treat with all the public type 2 charge points I’ve tried AND with UMC’s / granny cable converters from various car makes (and no they are designed to only supply what they can ‘suck’ and the AVC2 ‘tells’ them what to supply).

simpbms allows 2 switchable charge rates so I use mine at 32A and 13A (for cold days and for charging off PV’s).

The only difference I went for the non HV Hyper9 which has same output (88kW iirc) but with 5 modules and higher amps (up to 750A vs 500). I went this route as low weight was vital for my conversion, and this saved 25kg.

The UK conversion scene is v active with many strong companies such as ECC, zero ev, eco classics, 2nd life batteries etc. etc. even on TV with Vintage Voltage and 5th gear recharged.
cheers, Mark, Dorset, UK

 

[VintageVolts]

Similar setup here (also UK), with Elcon 6.6Kw charger and Tesla modules (both controlled by simpBMS, which I highly rate as it uses the original Tesla module pcb’s / bleed resistor controllers).

I got an AVC2 from Electric Classic Cars with resistor change to suit UK charger infrastructure. This Works a treat with all the public type 2 charge points I’ve tried AND with UMC’s / granny cable converters from various car makes (and no they are designed to only supply what they can ‘suck’ and the AVC2 ‘tells’ them what to supply).

simpbms allows 2 switchable charge rates so I use mine at 32A and 13A (for cold days and for charging off PV’s).

The only difference I went for the non HV Hyper9 which has same output (88kW iirc) but with 5 modules and higher amps (up to 750A vs 500). I went this route as low weight was vital for my conversion, and this saved 25kg.

The UK conversion scene is v active with many strong companies such as ECC, zero ev, eco classics, 2nd life batteries etc. etc. even on TV with Vintage Voltage and 5th gear recharged.
cheers, Mark, Dorset, UK

Thanks for this, Mark, also i've enjoyed your Lotus Elon videos on YouTube which have been a great help! I'll look into the SimpBMS, so far i've been leaning towards the Orion BMS, there's a good walkthrough of it https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRYWT-8LWrw (off topic i know but may be handy to someone)

 

[agmatthews]

Hi Tom,

I too am a long time lurker with an old landy in the shed getting converted to EV
I will be using seven Tesla 5.3kWh modules and a Hyper 9 HV driving through the original clutch and gearbox

I have just put together a battery trolley and bench test setup for the batteries, BMS (Orion BMS2) and 3.3kW Charger / DC-DC (Ovar / Stealth EV)
It all started with wanting to move the 150kg+ of batteries around safely while I am still removing the rust from the landrover.
It was a good learning experience.

Be warned with the cell taps, thermistors, and HVDC cabling there is nearly 100 connections just going to and from the batteries...
The cell taps need to be very carefully checked and tested with Orion BMS because if you get them wrong you can fry the BMS.
I hired an Orion cell tap validator tool for the final check before plugging things in ... and yes, I still have some tidying up to do

The Orion BMS will, out of the box, manage the Type 2 socket signalling and control the charger via CAN

You asked "what hardware (other than cable & conduit!) would i need to connect it up"

With the Orion there is a need for a source of 12v from the type 2 socket to indicate that charge power is available and a capacity to let the BMS switch the 240V on an off to the charger. This is particuarly important in the event the CAN control of the charger fails and the BMS needs to stop charging.

Here is my bench set up for this (before it went in its box)

Coming in at the middle is the Type 2 (single phase) AC power and control cables on the right is a 12V transformer and relay with AC to the charger going out ot the top right
On the top, far left is 12VDC coming in from a lead acid battery for 'always on' power to the BMS. Next to that is the CAN bus to the charger
Everything coming out at the bottom left goes off to the BMS (CAN, power and Type 2 CP and PD) and the chare safty signal from the BMS coming in to turn the relay on
Here I'm using a 10Amp relay which allows testing at low charge rates - the big relay is still in the post somewhere.

I obtained a Type 2 socket with 1m of cabling attached for less than $100AUD from 75.0US $ |32A Charger Connector IEC 62196 2 Charge Socket 32 A 110 to 250V With 0.5 m Cable|socket a|socket chargersocket iec - AliExpress.
This made wiring the type 2 socket part of the test bench up easy

It was most satifying to plug in the EVSE charger and see this
(and yes this is down under where it was 35DegC in the shade!)

 

[remy_martian]

Love the "battery trolley" idea 👍

 

[agmatthews]

Love the "battery trolley" idea 👍

It was good TIG welding practice!

 

[VintageVolts]

hi Andrew, this is really great, thanks for taking the time to put this up! Tom

 

[alexbeatle]

Hello.
Thank you for all this information!

I purchased Elcon TC Charger \ DC-DC converter - water cooled version CD-L 6.6KW+1.5KW CD-L系列_二合一_产品中心_铁城信息科技有限公司
and translated the manual with the MS Word (see attached). Most of it is self-explanatory, but there're few things I'm trying to understand. It has its similarities to the HK-L unit posted here, given it's the same company.
Perhaps somebody could help me understand...

1. The unit has internal charge port communication and lock control. I see that @4Foxtrot didn't use those, but rather the AVC unit. Did the charger complain at all? Did you try the status lights at pins 1E and 1F if they still showed the SoC?
2. What are these power inputs on pins 1H (The KL30 normal input is positive - Normally powered input 9-18V) and 4G (The KL31 normal input is negative)? Are these used to power the charger\dc-dc converter electronics - tie to the 12V battery via fuse?
3. What is the power output at pin 2H used for (OBC low-voltage power supply is positive 13.8V)? Is this like an always on power output I can use to power accessories, for ex. BMS?
4. My unit has 3 wires on the DC output connector. Wondering what the #3 wire is for? I assume it's the +ve input to the DC/DC section of the unit. So I would just connect both wires #1 and #3 to my battery pack +ve, just fused independently. (The block diagram in the datasheet shows as if the output connector has 2 wires and the DC/DC feeds from the charger output internally...🤔)
   1. Charger output positive pole;
   2. Common negative pole;
   3. DC input positive pole

Thanks in advance....

 

[alexbeatle]

Hello.
Thank you for all this information!

I purchased Elcon TC Charger \ DC-DC converter - water cooled version CD-L 6.6KW+1.5KW CD-L系列二合一产品中心_铁城信息科技有限公司
and translated the manual with the MS Word (see attached). Most of it is self-explanatory, but there're few things I'm trying to understand. It has its similarities to the HK-L unit posted here, given it's the same company.
Perhaps somebody could help me understand...

1. The unit has internal charge port communication and lock control. I see that @4Foxtrot didn't use those, but rather the AVC unit. Did the charger complain at all? Did you try the status lights at pins 1E and 1F if they still showed the SoC?
2. What are these power inputs on pins 1H (The KL30 normal input is positive - Normally powered input 9-18V) and 4G (The KL31 normal input is negative)? Are these used to power the charger\dc-dc converter electronics - tie to the 12V battery via fuse?
3. What is the power output at pin 2H used for (OBC low-voltage power supply is positive 13.8V)? Is this like an always on power output I can use to power accessories, for ex. BMS?
4. My unit has 3 wires on the DC output connector. Wondering what the #3 wire is for? I assume it's the +ve input to the DC/DC section of the unit. So I would just connect both wires #1 and #3 to my battery pack +ve, just fused independently. (The block diagram in the datasheet shows as if the output connector has 2 wires and the DC/DC feeds from the charger output internally...🤔) View attachment 131689
   1. Charger output positive pole;
   2. Common negative pole;
   3. DC input positive pole

Thanks in advance....

bump!?

 

[kennybobby]

In the older charger units there are 2 positive wires in the output cable of different size and color as shown below.

The smaller Green one does not carry current but is used to sense the battery pack voltage before charging begins to allow the controller to adjust and match the voltage on both sides of the output relay before it is energized (to switch the contacts with no current). This wire gets disconnected from the circuit after the relay kicks in

The larger Red wire carries the output current to charge the pack and it has an internal fuse (pia to access).

They have included a block diagram schematic in the manual; it doesn't show the internal connection of the output relay but does show an internal fuse.

Its hard to know what was intended but it would make sense that one pin is the OBC Output during Charging and the other is an HVDC Input for the DCDC during Drive mode. i'm not sure how you could test to verify this before use.