Greg Owen wrote:
> Is anyone going to be at AltWheels in Boston Friday/Saturday 9/28-29?
>
> http://www.altwheels.org/
>
> I'll probably run over during lunch tomorrow, either alone or with
> people from work I can drag with me.
>
> _______________________________________________
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>
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Martin Klingensmith wrote:
> I went for a short time last evening. The hybrid tahoe was a bit
> annoying eh?
> Excellent display for some plug-in Priuses though.
Personally I was kind of depressed by the various "big car company"
offerings. Maybe it is just me, but it seemed that they fell into two
categories - putting a little electric in for the green credentials, or
going overboard (e.g., ford's fuel cell + battery system) in a way that
I suspect will never be commercial (e.g., always vaporcar).
Of the homegrown stuff, there were two EVehicles; a little 1/2 golf cart
sized "science experiment" from some local university, and a lie-down
squirt-boat-shaped racing unit.
The former was extruded aluminum, permanent magnet DC motor, MillipaK
Sevcon controller, and (IIRC) 6-8 Trojan deep cycle (lead acid?)
batteries. I didn't get any performance specs, like I said, more like a
golf cart. Chain drive, didn't see any transmission or shifting capability.
The latter I didn't get details of, but I gather the races involve
everyone starting with the same amount of battery charge and seeing who
can go the longest. Nice fiberglass body, and an enclosed fiberglass
trailer for hauling it to race sites.
There were a handful of diesel cars (VW, MB) for either Biodiesel or
WVO, as well as Burke Fuels, one of the oldest Biodiesel suppliers in
the area.
The most impressive tent I saw was for a company - and of course I
forget the name - which installs solar for you, for free, and sets you
up to sell back to the grid. They own the system, they manage the grid
coordination, and you get some of the money from selling electricity
back to the grid. It's a pretty sharp idea, IMHO - it deals with the
biggest roadblocks to selling solar electricity into the grid:
1) No up-front investment in solar cells for the homeowner.
2) One customer (them) with big impact (many homes) deals with (usually
recalcitrant) electric company, rather than homeowner (small fry)
getting run around in circles by the (Electric Company) Man.
3) Homeowner goes green, gets (some) bill relief out of the deal with
less trouble and risk.
4) Assuming the looks don't get worse, improves the value of the house.
The most depressing (tent) I saw was some giant car-carrier with an
enormous ear of corn on it for some ethanol car. Ethanol annoys me. If
we wanted to go biofuels, wouldn't the right thing to do be to determine
the highest-payback crop we could switch to? Instead, decades of
looking out for the corn surplus farmers leaves us locked into a sub-par
ethanol source.
Overall, the event just wasn't what I'd hoped in some way. I brought a
(normal person) from work along with me, and she also felt vaguely
unsatisfied. I was happier going than not going, though 8).
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--- [email protected] wrote:
>
> [Personal (subjective) review of AltWheels follows.
> Not 100% limited to
> EVs, may contain fodder for non-EV discussion,
> please take it off-list
> with me so we don't spam the list if replying to
> those statements]
>
> Martin Klingensmith wrote:
> > I went for a short time last evening. The hybrid
> tahoe was a bit
> > annoying eh?
> > Excellent display for some plug-in Priuses though.
>
> Personally I was kind of depressed by the various
> "big car company"
> offerings. Maybe it is just me, but it seemed that
> they fell into two
> categories - putting a little electric in for the
> green credentials, or
> going overboard (e.g., ford's fuel cell + battery
> system) in a way that
> I suspect will never be commercial (e.g., always
> vaporcar).
>
> Of the homegrown stuff, there were two EVehicles; a
> little 1/2 golf cart
> sized "science experiment" from some local
> university, and a lie-down
> squirt-boat-shaped racing unit.
>
> The former was extruded aluminum, permanent magnet
> DC motor, MillipaK
> Sevcon controller, and (IIRC) 6-8 Trojan deep cycle
> (lead acid?)
> batteries. I didn't get any performance specs, like
> I said, more like a
> golf cart. Chain drive, didn't see any transmission
> or shifting capability.
>
> The latter I didn't get details of, but I gather the
> races involve
> everyone starting with the same amount of battery
> charge and seeing who
> can go the longest. Nice fiberglass body, and an
> enclosed fiberglass
> trailer for hauling it to race sites.
>
> There were a handful of diesel cars (VW, MB) for
> either Biodiesel or
> WVO, as well as Burke Fuels, one of the oldest
> Biodiesel suppliers in
> the area.
>
> The most impressive tent I saw was for a company -
> and of course I
> forget the name - which installs solar for you, for
> free, and sets you
> up to sell back to the grid. They own the system,
> they manage the grid
> coordination, and you get some of the money from
> selling electricity
> back to the grid. It's a pretty sharp idea, IMHO -
> it deals with the
> biggest roadblocks to selling solar electricity into
> the grid:
>
> 1) No up-front investment in solar cells for the
> homeowner.
>
> 2) One customer (them) with big impact (many homes)
> deals with (usually
> recalcitrant) electric company, rather than
> homeowner (small fry)
> getting run around in circles by the (Electric
> Company) Man.
>
> 3) Homeowner goes green, gets (some) bill relief out
> of the deal with
> less trouble and risk.
>
> 4) Assuming the looks don't get worse, improves the
> value of the house.
>
> The most depressing (tent) I saw was some giant
> car-carrier with an
> enormous ear of corn on it for some ethanol car.
> Ethanol annoys me. If
> we wanted to go biofuels, wouldn't the right thing
> to do be to determine
> the highest-payback crop we could switch to?
> Instead, decades of
> looking out for the corn surplus farmers leaves us
> locked into a sub-par
> ethanol source.
>
> Overall, the event just wasn't what I'd hoped in
> some way. I brought a
> (normal person) from work along with me, and she
> also felt vaguely
> unsatisfied. I was happier going than not going,
> though 8).
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
____________________________________________________________________________________
Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha! Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for today's economy) at Yahoo! Games.
http://get.games.yahoo.com/proddesc?gamekey=monopolyherenow
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keith vansickle wrote:
> I am going to the altcar expo in long beach ca in a
> couple of weeks and I sure hope it is better..I don't
> know if there is any connection between the two. This
> report downright depresses me...one home built
> (golfcar thing) and one electrathon...Boston must be
> the backwoods of electric vehicles
Well, bear in mind, this isn't sunny California. The weather here
probably (historically) has a higher impact; driving to work and parking
your lead-acid batteries in a below-zero parking lot all day might not
bode well for you leaving at 5 to head home.
I've asked a few MA-oriented questions on this and another EV list and
gotten few responses, so I don't know that there is much of an
enthusiast/club presence here.
That said, A123 is based in Watertown (next town out from Boston) and
Azure Dynamics bought out the Woburn MA Solectria and still has that as
a site. So there are businesses around it.
Insights from any other New Englanders on the state of EVs in Mass, as
well as comments on my cold weather hypothesis from residents of warm
states such as Michigan and North Dakota, are welcome.
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[email protected] wrote:
> Well, bear in mind, this isn't sunny California. The weather here
> probably (historically) has a higher impact; driving to work and parking
> your lead-acid batteries in a below-zero parking lot all day might not
> bode well for you leaving at 5 to head home.
>
> I've asked a few MA-oriented questions on this and another EV list and
> gotten few responses, so I don't know that there is much of an
> enthusiast/club presence here.
>
> That said, A123 is based in Watertown (next town out from Boston) and
> Azure Dynamics bought out the Woburn MA Solectria and still has that as
> a site. So there are businesses around it.
>
> Insights from any other New Englanders on the state of EVs in Mass, as
> well as comments on my cold weather hypothesis from residents of warm
> states such as Michigan and North Dakota, are welcome.
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
>
_______________________________________________
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[email protected] wrote:
> keith vansickle wrote:
>> I am going to the altcar expo in long beach ca in a
>> couple of weeks and I sure hope it is better..I don't
>> know if there is any connection between the two. This
>> report downright depresses me...one home built
>> (golfcar thing) and one electrathon...Boston must be
>> the backwoods of electric vehicles
>
> Well, bear in mind, this isn't sunny California. The weather here
> probably (historically) has a higher impact; driving to work and
> parking
> your lead-acid batteries in a below-zero parking lot all day might not
> bode well for you leaving at 5 to head home.
>
> I've asked a few MA-oriented questions on this and another EV list and
> gotten few responses, so I don't know that there is much of an
> enthusiast/club presence here.
>
> That said, A123 is based in Watertown (next town out from Boston) and
> Azure Dynamics bought out the Woburn MA Solectria and still has
> that as
> a site. So there are businesses around it.
>
> Insights from any other New Englanders on the state of EVs in Mass, as
> well as comments on my cold weather hypothesis from residents of warm
> states such as Michigan and North Dakota, are welcome.
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
_______________________________________________
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Martin Klingensmith wrote:
> Exactly, unless we can afford NiCad or Lithium we're not going to get
> very far on lead in February unless you have a garage (are you rich?)
I have a garage (I am not, unfortunately, rich). It is wonderful to hop
into the car in the morning and have it be above freezing temps; you can
go in a long sleeves and the heater will warm up before the chill gets you.
Parking in a glacier-like lot all day, on the other hand... Not good
for batteries. The car I'm planning is going to use insulation and
probably some form of heating to keep the batteries warm through the day.
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Ken Olum wrote:
> In past years I've had my Force at AltWheels. But this year they
> charged $150 for private exhibitors, and I didn't feel like paying
> it. That's one reason that it is dominated by big companies. The
> current location at Boston City Hall Plaza prohibits charging for
> admission, so all the money has to come from exhibitor fees or
> donations. Nevertheless, I feel that my car would be enriching the
> show, and showing the car certainly isn't enriching me.
Ah, now I understand. That sucks.
> On the subject of cold weather, the Force (built here in
> Massachusetts) really is the solution to it. It uses gel batteries
> in insulated and heated compartments. The range is 20% or 30% less
> in midwinter than midsummer, but it's not a big problem.
Any online info, pictures, etc? Is it based on an existing car frame or
a custom chassis? If the latter, can I interrogate you about how you
got it titled and registered in Massachusetts?
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Ken Olum wrote:
> In past years I've had my Force at AltWheels. But this year they
> charged $150 for private exhibitors, and I didn't feel like paying it.
> That's one reason that it is dominated by big companies. The current
> location at Boston City Hall Plaza prohibits charging for admission,
> so all the money has to come from exhibitor fees or donations.
> Nevertheless, I feel that my car would be enriching the show, and
> showing the car certainly isn't enriching me.
Ah, now I understand. That sucks.
> On the subject of cold weather, the Force (built here in
> Massachusetts) really is the solution to it. It uses gel batteries in
> insulated and heated compartments. The range is 20% or 30% less in
> midwinter than midsummer, but it's not a big problem.
Any online info, pictures, etc? Is it based on an existing car frame or a custom chassis? If the latter, can I interrogate you about how you got it titled and registered in Massachusetts?
_______________________________________________
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