[EVDL] Converting Bloodmobiles to electric?

861 Views 7 Replies 1 Participant Last post by EVDL List, Dec 22, 2010

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Discussion Starter · Dec 20, 2010

Hi Folks,

Being a regular blood donor, I'm on the usual plea-lists, and the latest
plea got me thinking. The local blood bank is asking for money to buy
new Bloodmobiles (converted RVs), as the current ones no longer pass
smogtests.

Having done one conversion (a small one tho - Porsche 914), I think it
would be doable, but wanted to get feedback from the Usual Suspects
before pushing forward.

My thoughts - use a simple system of DC motor (Warp11?), Netgain
controller, lithium batteries, BMS, and manzanita charger. Then put a
set of warning lights on the dash, and use the "gas gauge" to tell the
current charge.

Sounds simple to me, but what am I missing?

Cheers,
Peter

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Discussion Starter · #2 · Dec 21, 2010

Peter:

For starters, here are a few more questions: How far will they drive in a worst case day? Can they park it near a outdoor but weatherproof shelter for charging? What is the weight of the existing chassis? Is the existing chassis basically sound so that the conversion won't be bugged by rust, suspension, etc? How much money will the RC save?

/Bob

Peter C. Thompson wrote:

> Hi Folks,
>
> Being a regular blood donor, I'm on the usual plea-lists, and the latest
> plea got me thinking. The local blood bank is asking for money to buy
> new Bloodmobiles (converted RVs), as the current ones no longer pass
> smogtests.
>
> Having done one conversion (a small one tho - Porsche 914), I think it
> would be doable, but wanted to get feedback from the Usual Suspects
> before pushing forward.
>
> My thoughts - use a simple system of DC motor (Warp11?), Netgain
> controller, lithium batteries, BMS, and manzanita charger. Then put a
> set of warning lights on the dash, and use the "gas gauge" to tell the
> current charge.
>
> Sounds simple to me, but what am I missing?
>
> Cheers,
> Peter
>
> _______________________________________________
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Discussion Starter · #3 · Dec 21, 2010

On 20 Dec 2010 at 16:17, harry henderson wrote:

> a large, positionable, solar array on top all the power during the
> blood letting could be supplied and if the vehicle sits for a bit most
> of the charging too.

If you look at the square area available on a vehicle's roof, the real-world
output of affordable PV panels when so mounted, and the actual energy needs
of a large bus and medical equipment - even when standing still - I think
you'll find that providing sufficient onboard solar power for this
application is going to be a real challenge. Getting enough energy to push
the beast down the road any significant distance at any useful speed is
pretty well out of the question.

You should also prepare to be surprised, and not pleasantly so, by the
reaction when you propose this idea to the owners of the bloodmobiles. It's
pretty likely that flunking the smog tests isn't the only reason they want
(or need) new vehicles. With most organizations I've known, for-profit or
nonprofit, once they've decided that equipment needs to be replaced, they
don't much appreciate someone trying to tell them how they can carry on
using the old stuff.

But don't let that stop you; this case might be the exception.

David Roden
EVDL Administrator
http://www.evdl.org/

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Discussion Starter · #4 · Dec 21, 2010

Two things are slightly at odds here:
effectiveness and efficiency.
Many operations do not care much about efficiency
as long as they are effective. This is particularly
true of (for example) military. You want them to be
effective, but there are other examples such as
airbags and (fighterplane) ejection seats that must
be effective and you don't care how efficient they
are for the few cases you actually get to use them.

I think it is also true for the bloodbank, they need
to cover quite some ground each day, they have very
strict requirements about cooling and hygiene so the
power requirements even for sitting in a parking lot
are so large that I have seen they do not even try to
plug into the building power when they litterally
sit in front of an outlet, because that outlet is not
guaranteed to provide continuous power (effectiveness)
nor will it supply enough to run all equipment including
the AirCo of the bus sitting in the full Californian sun
on a blacktop desert...

Since the Bloodmobile has a fixed schedule and cannot
wait a few more hours to gather enough energy for the
next trip, this limitation will quickly tarnish a
solar-powered one, if you even can make it suck enough
solar power to move it...

Now it may be possible to design a Bloodmobile to run
from a solar array and that is a very interesting
challenge (and since I love solar, I would like to
see it done) but it is a different beast than the
conversion.

Typical EVs are somewhat efficient because they can
operate within specific boundaries, for example all
around-town errands or a fixed commute each day.
Running a Bloodmobile is a different beast, you
would need to gather data on the mileage that the
RV has and the steady state power draw when it is
operating as blood bank.
Then see if you can get close to that power requirement
with a solar array and see how that array can be
transported. Then consider what they should do on
days that the sun does not shine - probably keep their
genset anyway?

Success,

Cor van de Water
Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [email protected] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [email protected]
Tel: +1 408 383 7626 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
Behalf Of Peter C. Thompson
Sent: Tuesday, December 21, 2010 4:54 AM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: [EVDL] Converting Bloodmobiles to electric?

Hi Folks,

Being a regular blood donor, I'm on the usual plea-lists, and the latest
plea got me thinking. The local blood bank is asking for money to buy
new Bloodmobiles (converted RVs), as the current ones no longer pass
smogtests.

Having done one conversion (a small one tho - Porsche 914), I think it
would be doable, but wanted to get feedback from the Usual Suspects
before pushing forward.

My thoughts - use a simple system of DC motor (Warp11?), Netgain
controller, lithium batteries, BMS, and manzanita charger. Then put a
set of warning lights on the dash, and use the "gas gauge" to tell the
current charge.

Sounds simple to me, but what am I missing?

Cheers,
Peter

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Discussion Starter · #5 · Dec 21, 2010

-
>Sounds simple to me, but what am I missing?
-

Peter,

If the local blood bank had tons-of-money from nice donate-rs like you
(i.e.: Red Cross) and wanted to make showcase Electric Bloodmobiles,
MVP would be a good choice to do it. See the newswire I posted:
=

http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/MVP-quot-Winst=
on-quot-RV-EV-range-180mi-ts-65-MPH-li-ion-pack-recharge-24hrs-220V-td31387=
55.html

The Winston mentioned is of Li-ion Thundersky frame. He must have
beaucoup bucks to blow on an Electric RV (any RV'r will tell you an
A-class RV without an onboard genset is useless).

But if it is the much smaller blood bank operation like I think you
mean, they are 'used-to' just grabbing an RV, getting it converted to
their purposes, and tossing it when it costs too-much to maintain
(i.e.: it won't pass smog).

With that in mind, I am in alignment with what Cor posted about:
how their business is reactionary (here, there, everywhere), on a
schedule, and consume kWs of power whether moving, sunny, or not.

IMHO: Not every vehicle should be Electric (=A1Blasphemy!)
i.e.: making an Electric Space Shuttle is not a good idea.

A bloodmobile with a more efficient design that runs on a cleaner
renewable fuel, would be a wiser step in the right direction.
Since RE, Alt Fuels, and hybrids are OT ...

*** Please do not use evdl bandwidth on OT posts

... send me an email if you would like me to reply with links to those
for you to read and consider. You might come up with a cleaner way
for them to use your money-donations.

=

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Discussion Starter · #6 · Dec 21, 2010

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Discussion Starter · #7 · Dec 21, 2010

Start by finding out how much fuel their bloodmobile burns in a day right
now. That will give you a rough idea of how much onboard energy storage
would be needed.

I would agree 100% that this is not a project that a hobbyist should take
on. If they approve of the suggestion, you should look for a professional
converter with solid credentials.

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

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Discussion Starter · #8 · Dec 22, 2010

You didn't answer the range question?
Is there a generator on-board for air conditioning?

I did put a Warp11 into a Ford E350, however we only expecting 20 mph
speeds...after swapping out the pumpkin to 7:1 ratio. Project is still on
going. We are teaching another ES166 electric car conversion starting Jan
3rd for 2 weeks up here if anyone is interested.

http://www.uaf.edu/coursefinder/search-results/details/index.xml?CRN=38872&term=201101&campus=UAF-University

Peter C. Thompson <[email protected]>wrote:

> Thanks everyone! These have been great suggestions, and I will
> DEFINITELY take them into account.
>
> If anyone does professional conversions in San Diego, please let me know
> offline.
>
> Cheers,
> Peter
>
> On 12/21/2010 6:45 AM, David Roden wrote:
> > Start by finding out how much fuel their bloodmobile burns in a day right
> > now. That will give you a rough idea of how much onboard energy storage
> > would be needed.
> >
> > I would agree 100% that this is not a project that a hobbyist should take
> > on. If they approve of the suggestion, you should look for a
> professional
> > converter with solid credentials.
> >
> > David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
> > EVDL Administrator
>
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