[EVDL List]

I have a EVI MCS 100-3 EVSE that I have retrofitted by replacing the Avcon with a Yazaki. What I have discovered however is that this particular unit was programmed to only allow one charge cycle per charge request. That is to say once a charge request is completed the unit will no longer provide a pilot signal until it is unplugged and plugged back in again. This behavior prevents the EVSE from working properly with my new Leaf.

According to Jason at ClipperCreek this programming was done to get around a bug that was in the original Honda EV Plus. The bug was that after the Honda EV Plus finished a charge cycle it would keep listening to the pilot if it was plugged in and would eventually kill the 12 volt battery as a result. So having the pilot shut down after one cycle prevented this.

I was told by the folks at ClipperCreek that there is currently no practical method to remove this single cycle programming from this unit and I should just consider buying a new unit or continue to work with this unit as is. I was also told that they no longer have the documents or programming equipment for this unit.

What information about the unit I could find on the web http://www.bowzerbird.com/eviweb/products2.html#mcs100

So I am looking for help in removing this single cycle feature. Any help or suggestions will be appreciated. Thanks!
_________________________________________________________________
Send and receive anonymous emails to your inbox with InboxAlias.
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[EVDL List]

So, what you want is a small circuit that listens to the pilot,
when the pilot completely disappears it will power up a relay
where the relay has a normally closed contact in the feed to
the charger, so the charger auto-resets itself as soon as
the pilot signal disappears.

This what you want?
How experienced are you with designing and building some
electronics?
This would probably not be more than 2 transistors,
a capacitor, three resistors, a diode and a relay.

Regards,

Cor van de Water
Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [email protected] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [email protected]
Tel: +1 408 383 7626 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
Behalf Of [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 2:24 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [EVDL] Need help retrofitting EVI MCS 100-3 EVSE

I have a EVI MCS 100-3 EVSE that I have retrofitted by replacing the
Avcon with a Yazaki. What I have discovered however is that this
particular unit was programmed to only allow one charge cycle per charge
request. That is to say once a charge request is completed the unit
will no longer provide a pilot signal until it is unplugged and plugged
back in again. This behavior prevents the EVSE from working properly
with my new Leaf.

According to Jason at ClipperCreek this programming was done to get
around a bug that was in the original Honda EV Plus. The bug was that
after the Honda EV Plus finished a charge cycle it would keep listening
to the pilot if it was plugged in and would eventually kill the 12 volt
battery as a result. So having the pilot shut down after one cycle
prevented this.

I was told by the folks at ClipperCreek that there is currently no
practical method to remove this single cycle programming from this unit
and I should just consider buying a new unit or continue to work with
this unit as is. I was also told that they no longer have the documents
or programming equipment for this unit.

What information about the unit I could find on the web
http://www.bowzerbird.com/eviweb/products2.html#mcs100

So I am looking for help in removing this single cycle feature. Any
help or suggestions will be appreciated. Thanks!
_________________________________________________________________
Send and receive anonymous emails to your inbox with InboxAlias.
http://www.inboxalias.com

_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
| OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
| OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev

_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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[EVDL List]

[email protected] wrote:
> I have a EVI MCS 100-3 EVSE that I have retrofitted by replacing the
> Avcon with a Yazaki. What I have discovered however is that this
> particular unit was programmed to only allow one charge cycle per
> charge request. That is to say once a charge request is completed
> the unit will no longer provide a pilot signal until it is unplugged
> and plugged back in again. This behavior prevents the EVSE from
> working properly with my new Leaf.

Seems rather short-sighted to modify the charge station so it only works
with one particular EV. A 90-day warranty on a product advertised as
"extremely reliable" is also peculiar.

If this is your own MCS 100-3, can't you simply eliminate or bypass the
relay that is turning off the AC power?

--
Lee A. Hart | Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave N | Forget the perfect offering
Sartell MN 56377 | There is a crack in everything
leeahart earthlink.net | That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen

_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
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[EVDL List]

OK, now I understand the problem better: it is not just that the
charger will only generate one charging cycle, but that the Leaf
will use more than one cycle to charge, as it starts with a sort
of a test (probing) cycle.

I think I have seen the circuit that generates the pilot for the
AVCON that is used in the EAAEV's AVCON adapter box which could
be plugged into a regular 240V outlet if I am not mistaken.

So I agree - just generate a fake pilot and see what happens.

Success,

Cor van de Water
Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [email protected] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [email protected]
Tel: +1 408 383 7626 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behal=
f Of Steven Spies
Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 3:59 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [EVDL] Need help retrofitting EVI MCS 100-3 EVSE

Thanks for the suggestion but unfortunately that will not work in my case.

I had already thought about doing what you suggest and simulated it by mome=
ntarily, like for a split second, disconnecting the pilot within the EVSE w=
hile plugged into the Leaf. The result is that the Leaf still goes throu=
gh this "testing" cycle where it requests a momentary charge. The Leaf d=
oes this cycle every time it is plugged in or in this case when the pilot r=
eturns. Creating the circuit that you mention would just end up having t=
he EVSE and the Leaf in an infinite loop.

In the end I guess what I am looking for is a replacement pilot generator t=
hat I can use in this EVSE or a way to hack the EVSE in such a way that rem=
oves the disabling of the pilot after a cycle. I am fairly good with too=
ls and electronics and I am willing to disassemble this EVSE for further ex=
ploration since with its current limitation it is not much good for using w=
ith the Leaf. I can get by with just L1 charging with the Leaf for now b=
ut if I don't find a solution for this EVSE soon I will probably purchase a=
different EVSE and offer this one for sale.

<[email protected]> wrote:
> Original email sent from: [email protected]
>
> So, what you want is a small circuit that listens to the pilot, when =

> the pilot completely disappears it will power up a relay where the =

> relay has a normally closed contact in the feed to the charger, so the =

> charger auto-resets itself as soon as the pilot signal disappears.
>
> This what you want?
> How experienced are you with designing and building some electronics?
> This would probably not be more than 2 transistors, a capacitor, three =

> resistors, a diode and a relay.
>
> Regards,
>
> Cor van de Water
> Director HW & Systems Architecture Group Proxim Wireless Corporation =

> http://www.proxim.com
> Email: [email protected] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [email protected]
> Tel: +1 408 383 7626 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On =

> Behalf Of [email protected]
> Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 2:24 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: [EVDL] Need help retrofitting EVI MCS 100-3 EVSE
>
> I have a EVI MCS 100-3 EVSE that I have retrofitted by replacing the =

> Avcon with a Yazaki. What I have discovered however is that this =

> particular unit was programmed to only allow one charge cycle per =

> charge request. That is to say once a charge request is completed the =

> unit will no longer provide a pilot signal until it is unplugged and =

> plugged back in again. This behavior prevents the EVSE from working =

> properly with my new Leaf.
>
> According to Jason at ClipperCreek this programming was done to get =

> around a bug that was in the original Honda EV Plus. The bug was that =

> after the Honda EV Plus finished a charge cycle it would keep =

> listening to the pilot if it was plugged in and would eventually kill =

> the 12 volt battery as a result. So having the pilot shut down after =

> one cycle prevented this.
>
> I was told by the folks at ClipperCreek that there is currently no =

> practical method to remove this single cycle programming from this =

> unit and I should just consider buying a new unit or continue to work =

> with this unit as is. I was also told that they no longer have the =

> documents or programming equipment for this unit.
>
> What information about the unit I could find on the web =

> http://www.bowzerbird.com/eviweb/products2.html#mcs100
>
> So I am looking for help in removing this single cycle feature. Any =

> help or suggestions will be appreciated. Thanks!
> _________________________________________________________________
> Send and receive anonymous emails to your inbox with InboxAlias.
> http://www.inboxalias.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> | OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
> | OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
> _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> | OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
> | OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
>
>

_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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[EVDL List]

Ah, yes: the pilot is 1kHz 12V with 1kOhm series resistance.
I guess that a NE555 timer with the correct components
around it will be sufficient to trick the Leaf into charging.
www.aracnet.com/%7Ermerwin/Avcon/AvconBoxWiring.pdf
See page 3

Success,

Cor van de Water
Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [email protected] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [email protected]
Tel: +1 408 383 7626 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behal=
f Of Cor van de Water
Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 4:07 AM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Need help retrofitting EVI MCS 100-3 EVSE

OK, now I understand the problem better: it is not just that the charger wi=
ll only generate one charging cycle, but that the Leaf will use more than o=
ne cycle to charge, as it starts with a sort of a test (probing) cycle.

I think I have seen the circuit that generates the pilot for the AVCON that=
is used in the EAAEV's AVCON adapter box which could be plugged into a reg=
ular 240V outlet if I am not mistaken.

So I agree - just generate a fake pilot and see what happens.

Success,

Cor van de Water
Director HW & Systems Architecture Group Proxim Wireless Corporation http:/=
/www.proxim.com
Email: [email protected] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [email protected]
Tel: +1 408 383 7626 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behal=
f Of Steven Spies
Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 3:59 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [EVDL] Need help retrofitting EVI MCS 100-3 EVSE

Thanks for the suggestion but unfortunately that will not work in my case.

I had already thought about doing what you suggest and simulated it by mome=
ntarily, like for a split second, disconnecting the pilot within the EVSE w=
hile plugged into the Leaf. The result is that the Leaf still goes throu=
gh this "testing" cycle where it requests a momentary charge. The Leaf d=
oes this cycle every time it is plugged in or in this case when the pilot r=
eturns. Creating the circuit that you mention would just end up having t=
he EVSE and the Leaf in an infinite loop.

In the end I guess what I am looking for is a replacement pilot generator t=
hat I can use in this EVSE or a way to hack the EVSE in such a way that rem=
oves the disabling of the pilot after a cycle. I am fairly good with too=
ls and electronics and I am willing to disassemble this EVSE for further ex=
ploration since with its current limitation it is not much good for using w=
ith the Leaf. I can get by with just L1 charging with the Leaf for now b=
ut if I don't find a solution for this EVSE soon I will probably purchase a=
different EVSE and offer this one for sale.

<[email protected]> wrote:
> Original email sent from: [email protected]
>
> So, what you want is a small circuit that listens to the pilot, when =

> the pilot completely disappears it will power up a relay where the =

> relay has a normally closed contact in the feed to the charger, so the =

> charger auto-resets itself as soon as the pilot signal disappears.
>
> This what you want?
> How experienced are you with designing and building some electronics?
> This would probably not be more than 2 transistors, a capacitor, three =

> resistors, a diode and a relay.
>
> Regards,
>
> Cor van de Water
> Director HW & Systems Architecture Group Proxim Wireless Corporation =

> http://www.proxim.com
> Email: [email protected] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [email protected]
> Tel: +1 408 383 7626 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On =

> Behalf Of [email protected]
> Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 2:24 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: [EVDL] Need help retrofitting EVI MCS 100-3 EVSE
>
> I have a EVI MCS 100-3 EVSE that I have retrofitted by replacing the =

> Avcon with a Yazaki. What I have discovered however is that this =

> particular unit was programmed to only allow one charge cycle per =

> charge request. That is to say once a charge request is completed the =

> unit will no longer provide a pilot signal until it is unplugged and =

> plugged back in again. This behavior prevents the EVSE from working =

> properly with my new Leaf.
>
> According to Jason at ClipperCreek this programming was done to get =

> around a bug that was in the original Honda EV Plus. The bug was that =

> after the Honda EV Plus finished a charge cycle it would keep =

> listening to the pilot if it was plugged in and would eventually kill =

> the 12 volt battery as a result. So having the pilot shut down after =

> one cycle prevented this.
>
> I was told by the folks at ClipperCreek that there is currently no =

> practical method to remove this single cycle programming from this =

> unit and I should just consider buying a new unit or continue to work =

> with this unit as is. I was also told that they no longer have the =

> documents or programming equipment for this unit.
>
> What information about the unit I could find on the web =

> http://www.bowzerbird.com/eviweb/products2.html#mcs100
>
> So I am looking for help in removing this single cycle feature. Any =

> help or suggestions will be appreciated. Thanks!
> _________________________________________________________________
> Send and receive anonymous emails to your inbox with InboxAlias.
> http://www.inboxalias.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> | OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
> | OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
> _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> | OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
> | OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
>
>

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| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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[EVDL List]

So can one just supply 220vac to the leaf J1772 and it will charge? Or does the Charger in the Leaf
and the Charging station actually exchange signals?

Rush

----- Original Message -----
From: "Cor van de Water" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, January 31, 2011 3:37 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Need help retrofitting EVI MCS 100-3 EVSE


OK, now I understand the problem better: it is not just that the
charger will only generate one charging cycle, but that the Leaf
will use more than one cycle to charge, as it starts with a sort
of a test (probing) cycle.

I think I have seen the circuit that generates the pilot for the
AVCON that is used in the EAAEV's AVCON adapter box which could
be plugged into a regular 240V outlet if I am not mistaken.

So I agree - just generate a fake pilot and see what happens.

Success,

Cor van de Water
Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [email protected] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [email protected]
Tel: +1 408 383 7626 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Steven Spies
Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 3:59 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [EVDL] Need help retrofitting EVI MCS 100-3 EVSE

Thanks for the suggestion but unfortunately that will not work in my case.

I had already thought about doing what you suggest and simulated it by momentarily, like for a split
second, disconnecting the pilot within the EVSE while plugged into the Leaf. The result is that the
Leaf still goes through this "testing" cycle where it requests a momentary charge. The Leaf does
this cycle every time it is plugged in or in this case when the pilot returns. Creating the circuit
that you mention would just end up having the EVSE and the Leaf in an infinite loop.

In the end I guess what I am looking for is a replacement pilot generator that I can use in this
EVSE or a way to hack the EVSE in such a way that removes the disabling of the pilot after a cycle.
I am fairly good with tools and electronics and I am willing to disassemble this EVSE for further
exploration since with its current limitation it is not much good for using with the Leaf. I can get
by with just L1 charging with the Leaf for now but if I don't find a solution for this EVSE soon I
will probably purchase a different EVSE and offer this one for sale.

<[email protected]> wrote:
> Original email sent from: [email protected]
>
> So, what you want is a small circuit that listens to the pilot, when
> the pilot completely disappears it will power up a relay where the
> relay has a normally closed contact in the feed to the charger, so the
> charger auto-resets itself as soon as the pilot signal disappears.
>
> This what you want?
> How experienced are you with designing and building some electronics?
> This would probably not be more than 2 transistors, a capacitor, three
> resistors, a diode and a relay.
>
> Regards,
>
> Cor van de Water
> Director HW & Systems Architecture Group Proxim Wireless Corporation
> http://www.proxim.com
> Email: [email protected] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
> Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [email protected]
> Tel: +1 408 383 7626 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
> Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
> Behalf Of [email protected]
> Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 2:24 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: [EVDL] Need help retrofitting EVI MCS 100-3 EVSE
>
> I have a EVI MCS 100-3 EVSE that I have retrofitted by replacing the
> Avcon with a Yazaki. What I have discovered however is that this
> particular unit was programmed to only allow one charge cycle per
> charge request. That is to say once a charge request is completed the
> unit will no longer provide a pilot signal until it is unplugged and
> plugged back in again. This behavior prevents the EVSE from working
> properly with my new Leaf.
>
> According to Jason at ClipperCreek this programming was done to get
> around a bug that was in the original Honda EV Plus. The bug was that
> after the Honda EV Plus finished a charge cycle it would keep
> listening to the pilot if it was plugged in and would eventually kill
> the 12 volt battery as a result. So having the pilot shut down after
> one cycle prevented this.
>
> I was told by the folks at ClipperCreek that there is currently no
> practical method to remove this single cycle programming from this
> unit and I should just consider buying a new unit or continue to work
> with this unit as is. I was also told that they no longer have the
> documents or programming equipment for this unit.
>
> What information about the unit I could find on the web
> http://www.bowzerbird.com/eviweb/products2.html#mcs100
>
> So I am looking for help in removing this single cycle feature. Any
> help or suggestions will be appreciated. Thanks!
> _________________________________________________________________
> Send and receive anonymous emails to your inbox with InboxAlias.
> http://www.inboxalias.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> | OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
> | OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
> _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> | OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
> | OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
>
>

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[EVDL List]

Rush wrote:

> So can one just supply 220vac to the leaf J1772 and it will
> charge? Or does the Charger in the Leaf and the Charging
> station actually exchange signals?

Any properly J1772-compliant charger will not operate unless the pilot signal from the EVSE is present and is within fairly strict bounds both in terms of frequency and duty cycle.

I would expect the Leaf charger to be properly J1772-compliant, and therefore that it will not charge unless there is a valid pilot signal in addition to the 220VAC.

Cheers,

Roger.

_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
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[EVDL List]

On Tue Roger wrote:
> I would expect the Leaf charger to be properly J1772-compliant,
> and therefore that it will not charge unless there is a valid pilot
> signal in addition to the 220VAC.

So I wonder what this means for opportunity charging. Will it be
possible to plug in to any standard outlet? Will you need an adapter
to convince the charger to operate a some minimal level?

DAC

Roger Stockton <[email protected]> wrote:
> Rush wrote:
>
>> So can one just supply 220vac to the leaf J1772 and it will
>> charge? Or does the Charger in the Leaf and the Charging
>> station actually exchange signals?
>
> Any properly J1772-compliant charger will not operate unless the pilot signal from the EVSE is present and is within fairly strict bounds both in terms of frequency and duty cycle.
>
> I would expect the Leaf charger to be properly J1772-compliant, and therefore that it will not charge unless there is a valid pilot signal in addition to the 220VAC.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Roger.
>
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[EVDL List]

dave cover wrote:

> So I wonder what this means for opportunity charging. Will it
> be possible to plug in to any standard outlet? Will you need
> an adapter to convince the charger to operate a some minimal level?

Yes, and yes. ;^>

Both the Leaf and Volt come with an opportunity charge cord, which is an extension cord with a J1772 handle on the car end and an ordinary NEMA 5-15 plug on the other. I didn't look closely at the Leaf's cord, but the Volt one has some electronics in it that I expect look after generating the required J1772 pilot signal.

Cheers,

Roger.

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