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[EVDL] NO FOAM in E-Boat!

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Hi electric wooden boat folk's,

I need to mention that putting expanding foam in a wooden E-boat is a very *BAD* idea. I had to chop out *all* the expanding foam in my www.evalbum.com/2749 electric Cat that Jerry Dycus built (he told me *not* to use foam but another <aluminum> boat guy told me to). The foam *absorbs* moisture over time and *rots* the wood its' in contact with so I spent a fair amount of the winter season chopping out the foam bit-by-bit with a sawzall, digging bar and crowbar filling 20ea 55 gallon trashbags. Then I had to replace the rotted wood sections *and* reinforce with woven fiberglass matt, 3 coats of 1:1 Epoxy from Fiberglass Coatings Inc in St. Petersburg Fla (near where i picked the boat up Spring 09'). Where the foam contacted it only took 6 months to *rot* out the wood, turns soft & black, places you could put your hand through. The foam works ok (set high, not near waterline!) in *aluminum* canoes if instantly tipped, not soaked in water or high humidity for a long time!
. With the foam in the boat it was impossible to bildge pump out the water that seaped around the foam to the bottom during rain, splashing or high humidity. The foam eventually gets *heavy* from absorbing water over time and weight is the enemy in an electric boat for efficency amps per mph.

Last night there was one section that was hard to get to in the front pointy V hull and discovered that it rotted too from the inside, adhered to the plywood, dry'd a bit and then sucked in the front sides creating two 1 foot deep dents. I managed to chop it out in bits all night, the wood was so rotten where the foam contacted it, i could poke my finger easily through the hull to the oiutside through the blackenned rot. Tonight I'll put a scizzors jack in to expand the warped wood out and epoxy patch another 1/4" ply from the inside then reinforce on the outside with fiberglass matt and three coats sanding between each coat.

BTW, the cat has six bildge pumps now for the six bulkheaeds with humidity detectors, see circuits: www.evdl.org/lib/mh/

The good thing about a wood boat is it's easily repairable. The bad thing about a wooden boat is it needs lots of repair.

I bought the standard expanding foam (but don't do this), 10 gallons worth from Fiberglass Coatings Inc www.fcbi.com that I also bought my 1:1 Epoxy and fiberglass matt from for re-enforcing the keel since I hit rocks sometimes when beaching on the islands. FYI, the 1:1 Epoxy is 125231 activator and 125463 laminating resin, use cotton if thickening is needed in a paint mixing plastic cup.

Have a no-foam day,
Mark


> View message @
> Date: Mon, 30 Aug 2010 15:30:06 -0300
> From: Dan Baker <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Hello/ new to the scene/ my wooden electric boat!
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[email protected]>
> Message-ID:
> <[email protected]>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hey Lee,
>
> Yeah I suspect my motors aren't 32 amps a piece, although I do have a 60 amp
> fuse that feeds both motors that did pop once, not sure if something shorted
> or just a surge when I turned the key on and both were set on. I might
> have to look into these PM controllers more. I'm pretty happy with the
> speed, especially considering it's a brick I'm pushing through water. The
> foam sounds interesting, might be willing to try that in the off season.
> Initially I thought with barrels I could partially fill them with water if
> the boat was tippy however it is far from that.
>
> Thanks John and Lee for the design info on solar panels. Right now I have
> some 1/2 inch pressure treated plywood and some 1/8 inch acyclic plastic
> clear in 4x8 sheets. I like your
> panels John, seem to what I was thinking on building however a lot of web
> info seems to point to that plywood isn't watertight and the cells are very
> suspect to corrode easily. How long have you had your panels built- have
> you had issues with moisture? Lee, is the glass you glued down to
> tempered? I'm trying to find some recycled as buying new is definitely not
> cost effective, wondering if I could use regular glass. I don't think I
> will get the 280 watts of full power but then again I don't need all that to
> begin with. I'm charging the boat with a cheap car charger that does 12 or
> 2 amps. Rarely do I charge at 12, usually plug it in at night on weekends on
> 2 and it's usually charged back up even after a good day of play. The
> biggest benifit I see with solar is I hopefully won't have to plug in it
> anymore or nearly as much, it can be a pain plugging it in and the charger
> has to stay outside which worries me around wet weather and the odd beaver
> :) Last night I was out cruising trying to take some night shots and two
> of them were literally circling the boat, glad I made it out of PT wood
> and not something tastier! I believe it's all the lights that kept
> attracting them.
>
> John, whenever you are in Halifax you are welcome to stop by and go for a
> cruise (as well as anyone else, just give me some heads up). Unfortunately
> my season might be cut short this year as there is now a hurricane now
> pointed at us. I spent yesterday working on my makeshift trailer so
> hopefully i will be able to slip it in and out a little easier.
>
>

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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Mark Hanson-2 wrote:
>
>
> Hi electric wooden boat folk's,
>
> I need to mention that putting expanding foam in a wooden E-boat is a very
> *BAD* idea.
>
>
Yes you need a closed cell foam that can't absorb water and the wood should
be epoxied inside as well as out.
--
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Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Yes... just about all of the standard expanding foams that I've seen are
open cell foam... which is just like a big sponge when it gets wet. I've
occasionally seen the foam for houses available in closed cell (in damp
locations, where a wet sponge wouldn't function as insulation either).

Z

AMPhibian <[email protected]> wrote:

>
>
> Mark Hanson-2 wrote:
> >
> >
> > Hi electric wooden boat folk's,
> >
> > I need to mention that putting expanding foam in a wooden E-boat is a
> very
> > *BAD* idea.
> >
> >
> Yes you need a closed cell foam that can't absorb water and the wood should
> be epoxied inside as well as out.
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/NO-FOAM-in-E-Boat-tp2401482p2401562.html
> Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
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>
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
For the same reason, don't use expanding foam on steel vehicles. They
rust out almost immediately.

Lee Hart <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 8/31/2010 7:42 AM, Mark Hanson wrote:
>> I need to mention that putting expanding foam in a wooden E-boat is a
>> very *BAD* idea... The foam *absorbs* moisture over time and *rots*
>> the wood it's in contact with...
>

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