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Discussion Starter #1
Victor,

Do you know off hand what size the packs were?
I am looking for something to "properly" charge a 120V pack of STM5-180's.

>From: Victor Tikhonov =

>Subject: Re: [EVDL] Zivan vs. others

>BRUSA use to make such version for SAFT NiCd after SAFT
>twisted BRUSA's arms forcing company to redesign that flavor
>of chargers making them not user programmable - insuring that
>no warranty claims will come to SAFT due to wrong charger setting.
>SAFT specified exact profile and to make sure it will not be
>"cracked" asked BRUSA also change the hardware so replacing
>firmware chip on crippled charger would not restore functionality
>of open version.
>That was one time deal, BRUSA didn't like it and disagreed with
>such policy but built chargers for SAFT not to loose large contract
>with them. Well, at the end these chargers are of very little value
>for anything other than those NiCd packs (which are no longer
>produced by SAFT by the way). OTOH "normal" user programmable
>BRUSA units sell like hot pancakes - thanks for being ready
>for any battery that comes along in future.

Jim
'93 Dodge TEVan
'88 Fiero ESE (now with NiCd's)

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Discussion Starter #2
I believe, STM5-100MRE. Can't recall which OEM vehicle
it was used for, something similar to Ford's Think, but I just don't
recall. David Roden might know.

Victor

[email protected] wrote:
> Victor,
> =

> Do you know off hand what size the packs were?
> I am looking for something to "properly" charge a 120V pack of STM5-180's.
> =

>> From: Victor Tikhonov =

>> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Zivan vs. others
> =

>> BRUSA use to make such version for SAFT NiCd after SAFT
>> twisted BRUSA's arms forcing company to redesign that flavor
>> of chargers making them not user programmable - insuring that
>> no warranty claims will come to SAFT due to wrong charger setting.
>> SAFT specified exact profile and to make sure it will not be
>> "cracked" asked BRUSA also change the hardware so replacing
>> firmware chip on crippled charger would not restore functionality
>> of open version.
>> That was one time deal, BRUSA didn't like it and disagreed with
>> such policy but built chargers for SAFT not to loose large contract
>> with them. Well, at the end these chargers are of very little value
>> for anything other than those NiCd packs (which are no longer
>> produced by SAFT by the way). OTOH "normal" user programmable
>> BRUSA units sell like hot pancakes - thanks for being ready
>> for any battery that comes along in future.
> =

> Jim
> '93 Dodge TEVan
> '88 Fiero ESE (now with NiCd's)
> =

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oft=AE
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> =

> =

> =

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> =


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Discussion Starter #3
IN Ford Think, liquid cooled version.
Victor Tikhonov wrote:

> I believe, STM5-100MRE. Can't recall which OEM vehicle
> it was used for, something similar to Ford's Think, but I just don't
> recall. David Roden might know.
>
> Victor
>
> [email protected] wrote:
>> Victor,
>>
>> Do you know off hand what size the packs were?
>> I am looking for something to "properly" charge a 120V pack of =

>> STM5-180's.
>>
>>> From: Victor Tikhonov
>>> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Zivan vs. others
>>
>>> BRUSA use to make such version for SAFT NiCd after SAFT
>>> twisted BRUSA's arms forcing company to redesign that flavor
>>> of chargers making them not user programmable - insuring that
>>> no warranty claims will come to SAFT due to wrong charger setting.
>>> SAFT specified exact profile and to make sure it will not be
>>> "cracked" asked BRUSA also change the hardware so replacing
>>> firmware chip on crippled charger would not restore functionality
>>> of open version.
>>> That was one time deal, BRUSA didn't like it and disagreed with
>>> such policy but built chargers for SAFT not to loose large contract
>>> with them. Well, at the end these chargers are of very little value
>>> for anything other than those NiCd packs (which are no longer
>>> produced by SAFT by the way). OTOH "normal" user programmable
>>> BRUSA units sell like hot pancakes - thanks for being ready
>>> for any battery that comes along in future.
>>
>> Jim
>> '93 Dodge TEVan
>> '88 Fiero ESE (now with NiCd's)
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------
>> mail2web.com =96 Enhanced email for the mobile individual based on =

>> Microsoft=AE
>> Exchange - http://link.mail2web.com/Personal/EnhancedEmail
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> For subscription options, see
>> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>>
>>
>
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Discussion Starter #4
The Brusa chargers I used to have were from an even earlier vehicle, the
Pivco CityBee. The packs had 20, 6 volt STM-100MR (air cooled) modules. =


I have a battery box from one of these vehicles if anyone is interested.
One box holds all 20 modules and is designed to be 'easy' to remove from
the vehicle.

Ralph


Mark Dutko writes:
> =

> IN Ford Think, liquid cooled version.
>
Victor Tikhonov wrote:
> =

> > I believe, STM5-100MRE. Can't recall which OEM vehicle
> > it was used for, something similar to Ford's Think, but I just don't
> > recall. David Roden might know.
> >
> > Victor
> >
> > [email protected] wrote:
> >> Victor,
> >>
> >> Do you know off hand what size the packs were?
> >> I am looking for something to "properly" charge a 120V pack of =

> >> STM5-180's.
> >>
> >>> From: Victor Tikhonov
> >>> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Zivan vs. others
> >>
> >>> BRUSA use to make such version for SAFT NiCd after SAFT
> >>> twisted BRUSA's arms forcing company to redesign that flavor
> >>> of chargers making them not user programmable - insuring that
> >>> no warranty claims will come to SAFT due to wrong charger setting.
> >>> SAFT specified exact profile and to make sure it will not be
> >>> "cracked" asked BRUSA also change the hardware so replacing
> >>> firmware chip on crippled charger would not restore functionality
> >>> of open version.
> >>> That was one time deal, BRUSA didn't like it and disagreed with
> >>> such policy but built chargers for SAFT not to loose large contract
> >>> with them. Well, at the end these chargers are of very little value
> >>> for anything other than those NiCd packs (which are no longer
> >>> produced by SAFT by the way). OTOH "normal" user programmable
> >>> BRUSA units sell like hot pancakes - thanks for being ready
> >>> for any battery that comes along in future.
> >>
> >> Jim
> >> '93 Dodge TEVan
> >> '88 Fiero ESE (now with NiCd's)
> >>
> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> mail2web.com =96 Enhanced email for the mobile individual based on =

> >> Microsoft=AE
> >> Exchange - http://link.mail2web.com/Personal/EnhancedEmail
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> For subscription options, see
> >> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >>
> >>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > For subscription options, see
> > http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >
> =

> =

> _______________________________________________
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Discussion Starter #5
On 2 Oct 2007 at 21:38, Victor Tikhonov wrote:

> Can't recall which OEM vehicle [Brusa NLG412] was used for,
> something similar to Ford's Think, but I just don't recall.

Brusa NLG412s were used in prototype Pivco Citibees. That might be what
Victor is thinking of.

The ones I've worked with were spares from the Alameda Station Car project
in the mid to late 1990s. They were set up for 120v of STM5-100 nicads.

They weren't quite as locked down as Victor describes, but they did have
some limitations. For one thing, the nominal voltage wasn't configurable -
it would look like it was changing in the software, but not really change in
the charger's firmware. A PROM update from Brusa fixed that.

There may be a way to set them up for STM5-140s or STM5-180s or even some
other nicad, but I don't know what it is. Brusa might be willing to provide
an appropriate PROM. Maybe Victor knows.

However, from what he says, it sounds like later prototype Pivcos and/or
Thinks may have had completely crippled chargers, unalterable even by a PROM
update. I've also heard rumors that some of the Solectria-labeled chargers
were locked down, but I've not confirmed that. Either way, make sure you
know what you're getting if you buy a used NLG412.

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Note: mail sent to "evpost" or "etpost" addresses will not
reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my
email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =


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Discussion Starter #6
Brusa no longer supports the NLG4 chargers and has passed it on to
German company. David, don't you have this charger in one of your
cars? Ever tried to log on with the NLG4 software?

M
David Roden wrote:

> On 2 Oct 2007 at 21:38, Victor Tikhonov wrote:
>
>> Can't recall which OEM vehicle [Brusa NLG412] was used for,
>> something similar to Ford's Think, but I just don't recall.
>
> Brusa NLG412s were used in prototype Pivco Citibees. That might be
> what
> Victor is thinking of.
>
> The ones I've worked with were spares from the Alameda Station Car
> project
> in the mid to late 1990s. They were set up for 120v of STM5-100
> nicads.
>
> They weren't quite as locked down as Victor describes, but they did
> have
> some limitations. For one thing, the nominal voltage wasn't
> configurable -
> it would look like it was changing in the software, but not really
> change in
> the charger's firmware. A PROM update from Brusa fixed that.
>
> There may be a way to set them up for STM5-140s or STM5-180s or
> even some
> other nicad, but I don't know what it is. Brusa might be willing
> to provide
> an appropriate PROM. Maybe Victor knows.
>
> However, from what he says, it sounds like later prototype Pivcos
> and/or
> Thinks may have had completely crippled chargers, unalterable even
> by a PROM
> update. I've also heard rumors that some of the Solectria-labeled
> chargers
> were locked down, but I've not confirmed that. Either way, make
> sure you
> know what you're getting if you buy a used NLG412.
>
> David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
> EVDL Administrator
>
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> Note: mail sent to "evpost" or "etpost" addresses will not
> reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my
> email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

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Discussion Starter #7
On 3 Oct 2007 at 8:10, Mark Dutko wrote:

> Ever tried to log on with the NLG4 software?

Yes, it does indeed have intelligent conversations with nlg-e.exe.

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Note: mail sent to "evpost" or "etpost" addresses will not
reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my
email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =


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Discussion Starter #8
But you can't change the voltage- perhaps reduce it? I could never
confirm this regarding the surplus chargers you mentioned.

David Roden wrote:

> On 3 Oct 2007 at 8:10, Mark Dutko wrote:
>
>> Ever tried to log on with the NLG4 software?
>
> Yes, it does indeed have intelligent conversations with nlg-e.exe.
>
> David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
> EVDL Administrator
>
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> Note: mail sent to "evpost" or "etpost" addresses will not
> reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my
> email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

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Discussion Starter #9
On 3 Oct 2007 at 8:40, Mark Dutko wrote:

> But you can't change the voltage- perhaps reduce it? I could never
> confirm this regarding the surplus chargers you mentioned.

Right. With the factory PROM, the nominal battery voltage for the Saft
profile is fixed at 120. Every voltage-based internal variable in the
charge algorithm is calculated from the nominal voltage.

I don't know how many of those Alameda spare chargers are still floating
around - perhaps a few dozen?

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Note: mail sent to "evpost" or "etpost" addresses will not
reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my
email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =


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