[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

I do have another unused gmail account that I used to use for troubleshooting. I did have that idea tonight too. I should be able
to have my e-mail client pull all the EVDL e-mails through that account (which should include mine from the other address) but
filter only e-mails coming from me back into my EVDL folder on my local machine. Talk about a round about hack to be able to get
some list mail to work right.

I agree we shouldn't have to do this to get functionality. Almost all of my other lists I monitor are working (oddly enough the
NEDRA list is doing the same thing and not mirroring to me) EVTech is working fine, its like I never left that one.

Mike

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Chuck Hursch
> Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2010 12:29 AM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Test
>
> David(s), Mike, et.al.:
>
> Isn't this another example of the problem I was having (remember I
> talked with you about several months ago, maybe a year or more)? I set
> the mirror flag. I have a gmail account. I will get a sporadic
> mirroring, usually when I initiate a thread (ie. no RE in the subject
> line). If there is an RE, like when I respond on a thread, I rarely get
> a copy back.
>
> Mike, you can be a hermit, or do what I just did in the last day or so.
> Stand back and get your postings from a third-person's point of view:
> create another gmail and EVDL account (you can't have two EVDL
> accounts going to the same email address - bounced off that wall). Just
> be careful when you post that you post with the correct gmail account.
> Maybe this is simpler for me because it all gets POP3 downloaded to the
> same space on my computer. If you're up on the web for your email, this
> solution might not be so great, although forwarding from the "stand-off"
> account to your real account might solve the problem.
>
> What would be great is if we didn't have to fool with this problem in
> the first place.
>
> So coincidental that I just got around to doing something about it in
> the last couple of days, and here Mike is banging his head against the
> wall with the same problem. I saw all these test messages, and went "WTF?"
>
> Chuck
>

> EVDL Administrator wrote:
> > On 6 Mar 2010 at 23:03, Mike Willmon wrote:
> >
> >> So you're saying it's a problem getting back through gmail?
> >> Or that the list will not mirror it back to a gmail account?
> >
> > I'm not sufficiently conversant with the inner workings of Mailman to know
> > why or even whether it really does this, but the EVDL server doesn't seem to
> > send out every post to every recipient at the same time. It's not at all
> > unusual for others to see your posts before you do.
> >
> > Another common reason for a delay in receiving your own posts is that your
> > own mail server is heavily loaded, perhaps dealing with a flood of spam, and
> > is temporarily rejecting mail.
> >
> > To see whether your post has cleared, you can check the EVDL archive at
> > http://evdl.org/archive.
> >
> > David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
> > EVDL Administrator
> >
> > = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> > EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/
> > = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> > Note: mail sent to "evpost" an "etpost" addresses will not
> > reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my
> > email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
> > = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > General support: http://evdl.org/help/
> > Unsubscribe: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> > Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
> > Archive / Forum: http://evdl.org/archive/
> > Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >
> >
>
>
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[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

I think, though I'm not sure, that this is some kind of Gmail weirdness.
Here's why.

>From a Gmail account, first I tried emailing myself. That worked fine. It
showed up immediately in the inbox, slugged as from "me."

But then I set up a forwarder on one of my email servers, forwarding mail to
a Gmail address that I keep to monitor the list's performance. Then, from
that same Gmail address, I emailed the forwarder.

Forty-five minutes later, the message still hadn't made it back to my Gmail
mailbox.

I expected to find it in the spam folder, since one of the earmarks of spam
is that it sometimes has your own address spoofed as the sender. But it
didn't end up there either. It seems to have just vanished.

I don't know for sure that Gmail blocked the message because it originated
with my own Gmail account. There could have been some other reason. Still,
it suggests that maybe you're not allowed to send mail to your own Gmail
account through another server, only through Gmail's.

I tried the same thing with Yahoo, and to my surprise the same thing
happened. My message never came back to me, and it didn't end up in the spam
folder.

The same test DID work with Lycos Mail, however. That service used to have
some problems sending to EVDL, but it seems to be using a different front
end these days, so it might work for you.

If you don't like Lycos, there are probably hundreds or thousands of other
"free" (ad-supported) webmail services you could try. Surely one of them
will let you receive your own mail!

Another workaround might be to switch to digest mode, though you might not
like the format and/or the lack of timeliness.

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Note: mail sent to "evpost" or "etpost" addresses will not
reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my
email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =


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[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

David Roden <[email protected]> wrote:

>
> Another workaround might be to switch to digest mode, though you might not
> like the format and/or the lack of timeliness.

That's a horrible solution compared to the convenience of having all
the messages properly threaded in Gmail.

I use it with the EVDL and this simply isn't a problem. The messages
I send are still in place in the thread, only they are the "sent" mail
rather than a received version from the list server. So I assume it's
a feature rather than a bug.

I am happy to assume that if nobody replies, it's because it wasn't
worth replying to, not that the list software / operator is conspiring
against me

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[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

I think Evan nailed it. That would explain why my email to the list
doesn't "show up" until someone responds to it. At that point Gmail
"moves" it to the inbox to maintain the threading. What I actually
think it does is flag my email as both sent and inbox.

Evan Tuer <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Sun, Mar 7, 2010 at 3:29 PM, David Roden <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>>
>> Another workaround might be to switch to digest mode, though you might n=
ot
>> like the format and/or the lack of timeliness.
>
> That's a horrible solution compared to the convenience of having all
> the messages properly threaded in Gmail.
>
> I use it with the EVDL and this simply isn't a problem. The messages
> I send are still in place in the thread, only they are the "sent" mail
> rather than a received version from the list server. So I assume it's
> a feature rather than a bug.
>
> I am happy to assume that if nobody replies, it's because it wasn't
> worth replying to, not that the list software / operator is conspiring
> against me
>
> _______________________________________________
> General support: http://evdl.org/help/
> Unsubscribe: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
> Archive / Forum: http://evdl.org/archive/
> Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
>



-- =

David D. Nelson
http://evalbum.com/1328

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[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

Are you pulling in your email using IMAP or POP3. If using IMAP I think =
a client will actually will pull the gmail "sent" mail
too...maybe... I'm hoping. I'll change it later tonight and test it again.=
Although my client still keeps the sent mail as well I
could just make a rule to insert my own "sent" mail to the EVDL list into m=
y EVDL folder. Now that I think about it that may be the
better fix.

Thanks guys

Mike

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Beh=
alf Of David Nelson
> Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2010 10:36 AM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Test
> =

> I think Evan nailed it. That would explain why my email to the list
> doesn't "show up" until someone responds to it. At that point Gmail
> "moves" it to the inbox to maintain the threading. What I actually
> think it does is flag my email as both sent and inbox.
> =

>

Evan Tuer <[email protected]> wrote:
> > On Sun, Mar 7, 2010 at 3:29 PM, David Roden <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> Another workaround might be to switch to digest mode, though you might=
not
> >> like the format and/or the lack of timeliness.
> >
> > That's a horrible solution compared to the convenience of having all
> > the messages properly threaded in Gmail.
> >
> > I use it with the EVDL and this simply isn't a problem. The messages
> > I send are still in place in the thread, only they are the "sent" mail
> > rather than a received version from the list server. So I assume it's
> > a feature rather than a bug.
> >
> > I am happy to assume that if nobody replies, it's because it wasn't
> > worth replying to, not that the list software / operator is conspiring
> > against me
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > General support: http://evdl.org/help/
> > Unsubscribe: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> > Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
> > Archive / Forum: http://evdl.org/archive/
> > Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >
> >
> =

> =

> =

> --
> David D. Nelson
> http://evalbum.com/1328
> =

> _______________________________________________
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[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

Mike Willmon <[email protected]> wrote:
> Are you pulling in your email using IMAP or POP3.

I'm using the web front end. It's better in almost every way to any
offline client I've ever tried (and that's quite a few) especially on
large mailing lists. I use IMAP if I want to check something on my
iPhone though.

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[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

A quick web search confirmed what's going on here. You're not the only one,
and Gmail is indeed doing this on purpose.

http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2007-March/056130.html

"One of the 'features' of gmail is that it doesn't show you the return of
mail that you sent to mailing list, only the one you sent (so without the
mailing list subject line prefix, headers, etc). It's annoying as hell if
you ask me, but that's gmail for you."

I poked around a bit through gmail's settings, hoping to find a way to turn
this off, but ... no dice. It does sound like you can work around it
though, by using a different gmail account to archive messages, or copying
your own outgoing posts to your EVDL folder.

However, the fundamental problem is gmail. Unless you're really wedded to
some other feature (and a lot of folks really like the threading) I'd
suggest changing to a different email provider. Not Yahoo, either, which
from my tests apparently does the same thing. Nor Hotmail, which is
infamous for giving listservers fits.

I'll add a warning to evdl.org about Gmail and Yahoo. I'll also mention the
workarounds discussed here.

Dang it, those two services work pretty well other than this. Well, other
than this and the privacy issues some folks mention. However, I assume
that, because the privacy issues are so well known and widely discussed,
anybody who uses gmail already has considered them and isn't too concerned.

If anybody has other good, reliable webmail services to suggest for EVDL
use, please email me offlist (see the address fetching info below) telling
me what's good and bad about them. With those data, maybe I can add some
positive recommendations.

Sorry 'bout the hassle, Mike; hope you work things out.

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Note: mail sent to "evpost" or "etpost" addresses will not
reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my
email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =


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[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

Thanks all. Because I want to keep my archives local I think I'll just filter my sent items that go to the EVDL to my EVDL folder.
This doesn't give me confirmation that my mail made it, until someone responds. But it keeps my original post in my personal
archives.



> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of David Roden
> Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2010 3:47 PM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Test
>
> A quick web search confirmed what's going on here. You're not the only one,
> and Gmail is indeed doing this on purpose.
>
> http://mail.python.org/pipermail/mailman-users/2007-March/056130.html
>
> "One of the 'features' of gmail is that it doesn't show you the return of
> mail that you sent to mailing list, only the one you sent (so without the
> mailing list subject line prefix, headers, etc). It's annoying as hell if
> you ask me, but that's gmail for you."
>
> I poked around a bit through gmail's settings, hoping to find a way to turn
> this off, but ... no dice. It does sound like you can work around it
> though, by using a different gmail account to archive messages, or copying
> your own outgoing posts to your EVDL folder.
>
> However, the fundamental problem is gmail. Unless you're really wedded to
> some other feature (and a lot of folks really like the threading) I'd
> suggest changing to a different email provider. Not Yahoo, either, which
> from my tests apparently does the same thing. Nor Hotmail, which is
> infamous for giving listservers fits.
>
> I'll add a warning to evdl.org about Gmail and Yahoo. I'll also mention the
> workarounds discussed here.
>
> Dang it, those two services work pretty well other than this. Well, other
> than this and the privacy issues some folks mention. However, I assume
> that, because the privacy issues are so well known and widely discussed,
> anybody who uses gmail already has considered them and isn't too concerned.
>
> If anybody has other good, reliable webmail services to suggest for EVDL
> use, please email me offlist (see the address fetching info below) telling
> me what's good and bad about them. With those data, maybe I can add some
> positive recommendations.
>
> Sorry 'bout the hassle, Mike; hope you work things out.
>
> David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
> EVDL Administrator
>
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> Note: mail sent to "evpost" or "etpost" addresses will not
> reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my
> email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> General support: http://evdl.org/help/
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> Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
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[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

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YQpkaWZmZXJlbmNlLCBhbmQgd29ydGggbm90aW5nLCBidXQgbm90IGEgcmVhc29uIHRvIHJ1bGUg
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dHMuc2pzdS5lZHUvbWFpbG1hbi9saXN0aW5mby9ldgoK

 

[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

Except that I actually want a list that I subscribe to return my posted e-m=
ails to me. I could care less about the threading
feature. It is absolutely a reason for me to consider something else ;-)

Mike

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Beh=
alf Of Evan Tuer
> Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 1:56 AM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Test
> =

>

David Roden <[email protected]> wrote:
> =

> > However, the fundamental problem is gmail. Unless you're really wedd=
ed to
> > some other feature (and a lot of folks really like the threading) I'd
> > suggest changing to a different email provider.
> =

> Again, at risk of defending Gmail, I would point out that this is
> simply not a problem (or even noticeable) in practice. It's a
> difference, and worth noting, but not a reason to rule out using it.
> =

> _______________________________________________
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[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

Mike Willmon <[email protected]> wrote:

> Except that I actually want a list that I subscribe to return my posted e-mails to me.

OK, but I think this requirement is specific to you, so shouldn't be
included in general guidance for subscribers.

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[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

It has already been established that this requirement is not specific to me. I think that is why Dave mentioned he'd disclose it on
the EVDL help page.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Evan Tuer
> Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 2:47 AM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Test
>
>

Mike Willmon <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > Except that I actually want a list that I subscribe to return my posted e-mails to me.
>
> OK, but I think this requirement is specific to you, so shouldn't be
> included in general guidance for subscribers.
>
> _______________________________________________
> General support: http://evdl.org/help/
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[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

I could care less about it returning my posted emails to me, but without
decent threading (which I've found no service except gmail and thunderbird
that can do), I can't conceive of even using email period.... obviously
people differ.

Z

Mike Willmon <[email protected]> wrote:

> It has already been established that this requirement is not specific to
> me. I think that is why Dave mentioned he'd disclose it on
> the EVDL help page.
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
> Behalf Of Evan Tuer
> > Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 2:47 AM
> > To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> > Subject: Re: [EVDL] Test
> >
> > On Mon, Mar 8, 2010 at 10:39 AM, Mike Willmon <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> >
> > > Except that I actually want a list that I subscribe to return my posted
> e-mails to me.
> >
> > OK, but I think this requirement is specific to you, so shouldn't be
> > included in general guidance for subscribers.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > General support: http://evdl.org/help/
> > Unsubscribe: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> > Usage guidelines: http://evdl.org/help/index.html#conv
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> > Subscription options: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
> _______________________________________________
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[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

I have never had my emails sent back if I responded to emails in my email
program but it works fine if I am here on the Web posting messages. Mine is
set to send me a copy. It would be nice if I responded through my email
program if I could get my own back to me but I live with it as is.

I can get gmail emails even if I send them through my private email server.
Gmail works like all the others. I have never had a problem. If there is a
problem it must be with this forums programs. Like has been said. Not all
emails go through in a timely manner and that indicates a problem with
Nabble not gmail. It is I am sure out of our hands. Some work some don't.

Pete

-----
With off the shelf parts you can build an affordable EV.
http://greenev.zapto.org/electricvw
--
View this message in context: http://n4.nabble.com/Test-tp1583336p1584548.html
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

Zeke Yewdall wrote:
>
> I could care less about it returning my posted emails to me, but without
> decent threading (which I've found no service except gmail and thunderbird
> that can do), I can't conceive of even using email period.... obviously
> people differ.
>

Mail does an excellent job threading emails. But then again it's a Mac
program not a PC program



-----
With off the shelf parts you can build an affordable EV.
http://greenev.zapto.org/electricvw
--
View this message in context: http://n4.nabble.com/Test-tp1583336p1584552.html
Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

Mike, -------------------------- here is a "Work-around."
---------------------------------------------
I don't see the problem, if I am answering a thread with a "Reply" my
message is displayed along with all the others in the thread. If, HOWEVER,
I am originating a whole new concept and it is not a "Reply" then my message
does not appear in the inbox. It DOES appear in "SENT MAIL", so if I click
sent-mail there is my message and a click of the "INBOX" action box at the
top of the page puts a copy onto the "INBOX" Now if you find a better
service please inform us and we will all jump, but if you cannot, three
clicks is not to much for me and only if I am not replying, but originating
and no-one else replies...
Regards,
Dennis Miles
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

Mike Willmon <[email protected]> wrote:

> It has already been established that this requirement is not specific to
> me. I think that is why Dave mentioned he'd disclose it on
> the EVDL help page.
>
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On
> Behalf Of Evan Tuer
> > Sent: Monday, March 08, 2010 2:47 AM
> > To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> > Subject: Re: [EVDL] Test
> >
> > On Mon, Mar 8, 2010 at 10:39 AM, Mike Willmon <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> >
> > > Except that I actually want a list that I subscribe to return my posted
> e-mails to me.
> >
> > OK, but I think this requirement is specific to you, so shouldn't be
> > included in general guidance for subscribers.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
>
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[EVDL List]

Testing posting ability

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[EVDL List]

[EVDL] Test

Test

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| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
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[EVDL List]

Re: [EVDL] Test

Hi Geo;

Works like hell! What's this ugly , vicious rumor that Seattle is
THINKING of getting rid of it's Trolleybusses?Gees! Say it 'ain't so!

Bob.......were BUILDING a Trolley bus run at the Shoreline Trolley
museum. FIRST trolleybus to run in CT!
----- Original Message -----
From: "George Swartz" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 12:24 PM
Subject: [EVDL] Test


> Test
>
> _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> | OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
> | OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev

_______________________________________________
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