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70 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Jukka J=E4rvinen wrote:
> I have no problem to talk about the TS issues. I know how they do things =

> and it is far from western standards.
> =

> I've rolled the full case about the old cells in front of Winston. I =

> feel a bit troubled how he reacted on the issue. The amount of cells =

> that need changing is muuuch greater that anyone of us knows. I believe.

That makes no difference really. Amount of money they basically
stole is also much greater than anyone knows about, but that doesn't
bother Winston and Co.

Makes no difference if the staff, policies or whatever have changed
since 2003 when that happened. Bottom line - I'm (and 10 other people)
out of money and out of product we paid for. That fact didn't change.
Everything else is cheap talk, true or false.

> This is the reason I have always STRONGLY adviced NOT to buy cells =

> directly from them. I test all my cells in China before shipping. If any =

> bad I change it.

Perhaps I wasn't clear. If I buy TS sells from you and you in turn
buy them from TS for me, my money ultimately go to TS anyway. And I =

already paid them, and they know it.

So I should not buy TS product at all (and discourage others)
(directly or through Finnish distributor, makes no difference)
at least until one of 2 things happen:

a) - They return my money (and I can return their junk cells,
of course at their expense if they want)
b) - They fill *MY* trunk with 96 working cells *I* paid for.

It is of course your choice how to deal with TS, but if
you don't pressure and make them suffer, you encourage them
to keep doing what they did. I sincerely wish your business to
prosper, but if your sales decline because fewer people buy
their product (through you) - you suffer through no fault of
your own. Your own business practices are perfectly fine, but
it's not about you now, it's about TS and us (me in this case).
You weren't even involved in the initial group purchase.
Your only "fault" (for the lack of better word) is
your choice to still establish business with TS as if they
fully deserve it as good responsible supplier *by customer's
standards* (which they are not).

I don't want to impair your business, but I want to hold TS
responsible for theirs by spreading the word to get to option
a) or b) (see above) as close as possible.
Please suggest other means if you know of any.

I believe you, or any their distributor, can keep insisting
on them to rectify the situation by [partially] refusing to
deal with them so their bottom line suffers - you have much more =

influence and leverage than me and others who're just TS' end
customers.

You may be very right in assessment of current "changed" TS,
but [whether we keep talking about it or quit the thread now],
the fact remains - the trunk of my EV is still empty. Rub it in =

Winston's face.

Victor

p.s. A bit recomposed copy of this email is going to Winston
directly as well. Will see if it will have any effect.

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Registered
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70 Posts
Discussion Starter #2
I hear you Victor. Very clear. You can trust that I will use my leverage =

and we'll see how it goes.

Meanwhile I too encourage everyone to hold their purchases. Problem is =

that too may are buying with too good price. And only cells. So the =

malpractice is being encouraged.

Plain cells are forbidden to sell in here due the risks. I have never =

sold even a single cell without some version of my BMS/CCS. I've given =

few samples for free and forbid to use them. Just for show.

And I hate when I'm titled as "distributor" or "TS emloyee". I'm far =

from it. So get it F#*ing clear already! Or I can personally show why =

there is always some proper tooling behind the Sauna. ;)

What it comes to TS technology I still believe they have something good =

to offer. What is comes to anthing else regarding the company.. lot's of =

help is needed. Starting from warranty policies..

-Jukka

p.s.- The messages in English goes directly to Winstons assistents and =

they "translate" bad news in a way that it never goes through. It =

happens even during we talk face to face. Did they invent the concept of =

killing the messenger ....??...




Victor Tikhonov kirjoitti:
> Jukka J=E4rvinen wrote:
>> I have no problem to talk about the TS issues. I know how they do things =

>> and it is far from western standards.
>>
>> I've rolled the full case about the old cells in front of Winston. I =

>> feel a bit troubled how he reacted on the issue. The amount of cells =

>> that need changing is muuuch greater that anyone of us knows. I believe.
> =

> That makes no difference really. Amount of money they basically
> stole is also much greater than anyone knows about, but that doesn't
> bother Winston and Co.
> =

> Makes no difference if the staff, policies or whatever have changed
> since 2003 when that happened. Bottom line - I'm (and 10 other people)
> out of money and out of product we paid for. That fact didn't change.
> Everything else is cheap talk, true or false.
> =

>> This is the reason I have always STRONGLY adviced NOT to buy cells =

>> directly from them. I test all my cells in China before shipping. If any =

>> bad I change it.
> =

> Perhaps I wasn't clear. If I buy TS sells from you and you in turn
> buy them from TS for me, my money ultimately go to TS anyway. And I =

> already paid them, and they know it.
> =

> So I should not buy TS product at all (and discourage others)
> (directly or through Finnish distributor, makes no difference)
> at least until one of 2 things happen:
> =

> a) - They return my money (and I can return their junk cells,
> of course at their expense if they want)
> b) - They fill *MY* trunk with 96 working cells *I* paid for.
> =

> It is of course your choice how to deal with TS, but if
> you don't pressure and make them suffer, you encourage them
> to keep doing what they did. I sincerely wish your business to
> prosper, but if your sales decline because fewer people buy
> their product (through you) - you suffer through no fault of
> your own. Your own business practices are perfectly fine, but
> it's not about you now, it's about TS and us (me in this case).
> You weren't even involved in the initial group purchase.
> Your only "fault" (for the lack of better word) is
> your choice to still establish business with TS as if they
> fully deserve it as good responsible supplier *by customer's
> standards* (which they are not).
> =

> I don't want to impair your business, but I want to hold TS
> responsible for theirs by spreading the word to get to option
> a) or b) (see above) as close as possible.
> Please suggest other means if you know of any.
> =

> I believe you, or any their distributor, can keep insisting
> on them to rectify the situation by [partially] refusing to
> deal with them so their bottom line suffers - you have much more =

> influence and leverage than me and others who're just TS' end
> customers.
> =

> You may be very right in assessment of current "changed" TS,
> but [whether we keep talking about it or quit the thread now],
> the fact remains - the trunk of my EV is still empty. Rub it in =

> Winston's face.
> =

> Victor
> =

> p.s. A bit recomposed copy of this email is going to Winston
> directly as well. Will see if it will have any effect.
> =

> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> =


-- =

Jukka J=E4rvinen
R&D Director
Oy Finnish Electric Vehicle Technologies Ltd
Teollisuuskatu 24 A3
11100 RIIHIM=C4KI

jukka.jarvinen(at)fevt.com
cell phone +358-440-735705
wired phone +358-19-735705
fax +358-19-735785

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
 

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70 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
In order to help the cause, I intend to creat a link on all my webpages to
http://www.thundersky.us

If we can get a bunch of other folks to do this, it will move this page up
higher in the search engine results.

If enough people do it we can get it to be the first result returned when
searching for thundersky batteries. Perhaps that will get the message
across to these people that these kinds of bussiness practices are NOT
acceptable.

> I don't want to impair your business, but I want to hold TS
> responsible for theirs by spreading the word to get to option
> a) or b) (see above) as close as possible.
> Please suggest other means if you know of any.
>
> I believe you, or any their distributor, can keep insisting
> on them to rectify the situation by [partially] refusing to
> deal with them so their bottom line suffers - you have much more
> influence and leverage than me and others who're just TS' end
> customers.
>

--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.

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