DIY Electric Car Forums banner

1 - 8 of 8 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
70 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
http://www.networkworld.com/community/blog/white-house-outlines-ambitious-plan-get-1m-el
can I get that $7.5 rebate for a new battery pack??
I don't shop where I can't charge.
***********




-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/private/ev/attachments/20110128/24021900/attachment.html
_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
| OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
| OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
70 Posts
Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Re: [EVDL] !

On 28 Jan 2011 at 21:45, K O wrote:

> can I get that $7.5 rebate for a new battery pack?

Not bloody likely, IMO.

If (and that's a Hummer H3-sized IF) this incentive makes it through
congress, you can bet that it will be aimed at the mainstream automakers and
dealers, not at EV parts vendors. It will almost certainly be intended to
stimulate demand for new EVs, not new batteries for existing EVs.

I'd recommend writing your congressional representatives and suggesting that
any incentive law be written so that it provides at least some benefit for
existing EV owners. But if I were you, I wouldn't put off buying the
battery I needed now, in the hopes that this incentive will pass in a form
that I could use.

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
Note: mail sent to "evpost" and "etpost" addresses will not
reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my
email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =


_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
| OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
| OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
70 Posts
Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Re: [EVDL] !

You guys might want to consider creating a trade association for your
industry to handle such matters for the group. That is customarily how
things like this get done for groups with united lobbying
requirements, standards, etc.. I would suggest you consider something
like easy to say like EVA "Electric Vehicle Associaiton". A trade
association is recognized as a form of non-profit corporation under
the IRS tax code under 501c6 of the CFR. I can provide some assistance
in helping get this started if you have a group of leaders in your
industry who wish to found an association. It is not an easy task but
can be quite rewarding and can lead to many positive outcomes for an
industry. I was the founding president of the WISPA trade association
which has become the representative voice of the Wireless Internet
Service Providers in the US. You can see that group's efforts here:
http://www.wispa.org.
John Scrivner


EVDL Administrator <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 28 Jan 2011 at 21:45, K O wrote:
>
>> can I get that $7.5 rebate for a new battery pack?
>
> Not bloody likely, IMO.
>
> If (and that's a Hummer H3-sized IF) this incentive makes it through
> congress, you can bet that it will be aimed at the mainstream automakers =
and
> dealers, not at EV parts vendors. It will almost certainly be intended=
to
> stimulate demand for new EVs, not new batteries for existing EVs.
>
> I'd recommend writing your congressional representatives and suggesting t=
hat
> any incentive law be written so that it provides at least some benefit for
> existing EV owners. But if I were you, I wouldn't put off buying the
> battery I needed now, in the hopes that this incentive will pass in a form
> that I could use.
>
> David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
> EVDL Administrator
>
> =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =
=3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D
> EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/
> =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =
=3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D
> Note: mail sent to "evpost" and "etpost" addresses will not
> reach me. To send a private message, please obtain my
> email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
> =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =
=3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> | OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
> | OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
| OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
| OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
70 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Re: [EVDL] !

I will second that.
Today even the mighty FCC will use services of WISPA
and enforce everyone in the industry to require
consulting a WISPA database before turning any new
license-exempt 5 GHz radios on which could interfere
with Weather Radar stations on airports, so all
installers throughout the USA are consulting and
submitting their locations to the WISPA database.

This is only after many years of working with the
FCC on radio certification & regulatory subjects
that the FCC started taking the WISPA this serious.

The EV world would benefit from copying this example
and start targeting the lawmakers and regulators to
pave the way for EVs on the road.

Regards,

Cor van de Water
Director HW & Systems Architecture Group
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: [email protected] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [email protected]
Tel: +1 408 383 7626 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Tel: +91 (040)23117400 x203 XoIP: +31877841130

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behal=
f Of John Scrivner
Sent: Sunday, January 30, 2011 2:08 PM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] !

You guys might want to consider creating a trade association for your indus=
try to handle such matters for the group. That is customarily how things li=
ke this get done for groups with united lobbying requirements, standards, e=
tc.. I would suggest you consider something like easy to say like EVA "Elec=
tric Vehicle Associaiton". A trade association is recognized as a form of n=
on-profit corporation under the IRS tax code under 501c6 of the CFR. I can =
provide some assistance in helping get this started if you have a group of =
leaders in your industry who wish to found an association. It is not an eas=
y task but can be quite rewarding and can lead to many positive outcomes fo=
r an industry. I was the founding president of the WISPA trade association =
which has become the representative voice of the Wireless Internet Service =
Providers in the US. You can see that group's efforts here:
http://www.wispa.org.
John Scrivner


EVDL Administrator <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 28 Jan 2011 at 21:45, K O wrote:
>
>> can I get that $7.5 rebate for a new battery pack?
>
> Not bloody likely, IMO.
>
> If (and that's a Hummer H3-sized IF) this incentive makes it through =

> congress, you can bet that it will be aimed at the mainstream =

> automakers and dealers, not at EV parts vendors. It will almost =

> certainly be intended to stimulate demand for new EVs, not new batteries =
for existing EVs.
>
> I'd recommend writing your congressional representatives and =

> suggesting that any incentive law be written so that it provides at =

> least some benefit for existing EV owners. But if I were you, I =

> wouldn't put off buying the battery I needed now, in the hopes that =

> this incentive will pass in a form that I could use.
>
> David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
> EVDL Administrator
>
> =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =
=3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D EVDL =

> Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/ =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =
=3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =

> =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D
> Note: mail sent to "evpost" and "etpost" addresses will not reach me.
> To send a private message, please obtain my email address from the =

> webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
> =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =
=3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D =3D
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> | REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
> | Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
> | UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
> | OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
> | OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>

_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
| OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
| OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev

_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
| OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
| OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
70 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Re: [EVDL] !

John Scrivner wrote:
> You guys might want to consider creating a trade association for your
> industry to handle such matters for the group.

This would have been a great idea 5 years ago when the auto industry
couldn't care less about EVs. But now, I fear it is too late.

When big companies get interested in something, they insist on
dominating it. They will ignore, and even actively oppose any and all
trade organizations that they can't control.

I still think the EV industry needs its own trade group. but it needs to
be one that is *not* dominated by for-profit industries out to write all
the rules for their benefit. Good examples would be the "other EAA
(Experimental Aircraft Association), and the ARRL (American Radio Relay
League).

--
Lee A. Hart | Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave N | Forget the perfect offering
Sartell MN 56377 | There is a crack in everything
leeahart earthlink.net | That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen

_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
| OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
| OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
70 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Re: [EVDL] !

A hundred years ago (1909-1920 anyway) EV trade interests were largely
included as part of NELA, the National Electric Lighting Association, which
had an Electric Vehicles Chapter.

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf
Of Lee Hart
Sent: Sunday, January 30, 2011 11:52 AM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] !

John Scrivner wrote:
> You guys might want to consider creating a trade association for your
> industry to handle such matters for the group.

This would have been a great idea 5 years ago when the auto industry
couldn't care less about EVs. But now, I fear it is too late.

When big companies get interested in something, they insist on
dominating it. They will ignore, and even actively oppose any and all
trade organizations that they can't control.

I still think the EV industry needs its own trade group. but it needs to
be one that is *not* dominated by for-profit industries out to write all
the rules for their benefit. Good examples would be the "other EAA
(Experimental Aircraft Association), and the ARRL (American Radio Relay
League).

--
Lee A. Hart | Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave N | Forget the perfect offering
Sartell MN 56377 | There is a crack in everything
leeahart earthlink.net | That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen

_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
| OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
| OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev

_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
| OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
| OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
70 Posts
Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Re: [EVDL] !

Agreed! So far the most likely energy for forming such a "trade organizatio=
n" comes from, from my point of view, is NEDRA. They have a rule book for d=
rag racing EVs. AS EVs become production main stream, the technical c=
ompetition will get focused on the racetrack alongside gassers.. =


Otherwise EVAA hasn't shined in the same way..EVAA coulda woulda shoulda dr=
awn the line at PLUGS, since there is an =

established standard and the new-fangled expensive one that will now be =

use to stratify EV builders economically and technically.
I understand why clare bell writes SciFi about cats.. after working with en=
gineers ;-} =

I am not targeting Engineers; Bees & beekeepers are this way too. =

Suits and Bankers are NOT.

I don't shop where I can't charge.

-John Scrivner wrote:
> You guys might want to consider creating a trade association for your
> industry to handle such matters for the group.

This would have been a great idea 5 years ago when the auto industry couldn=
't care less about EVs. But now, I fear it is too late.

When big companies get interested in something, they insist on =

dominating it. They will ignore, and even actively oppose any and all trade=
organizations that they can't control.

I still think the EV industry needs its own trade group. but it needs to be=
one that is *not* dominated by for-profit industries out to write all the =
rules for their benefit. Good examples would be the "other EAA (Experimenta=
l Aircraft Association), and the ARRL (American Radio Relay League).

-- =

Lee A. Hart | Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave N | Forget the perfect offering
Sartell MN 56377 | There is a crack in everything
leeahart earthlink.net | That's how the light gets in -- Leonard C=
ohen



------------------------------

_______________________________________________
[email protected]
For general EVDL support, see http://evdl.org/help/
For subscription options, see http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev



End of EV Digest, Vol 42, Issue 42
**********************************



=

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/private/ev/attachments/20110131/1d477535=
/attachment.html =

_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
| OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
| OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
70 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Re: [EVDL] !

K O wrote:
> Agreed! So far the most likely energy for forming such a "trade
> organization" comes from, from my point of view, is NEDRA. They have
> a rule book for drag racing EVs. AS EVs become production main
> stream, the technical competition will get focused on the racetrack
> alongside gassers.

NEDRA has possibilities; also the EAA and even the EVAA as you mentioned.

The problem is that all of these groups are highly specialized. They
appeal to a small sliver of EV drivers, and so do not represent the
majority of EV drivers. No organization does!

It seems like any given special interest group needs to be threatened
until its members feel that they *must* act or be crushed. You see this
in the formation of the Experimental Aircraft Association, which formed
because commercial interests were basically out to ban private aircraft.
You also see it in the American Radio Relay League, when commercial
broadcasters sought to make amateur radio illegal.

Today, I think the vested interests (oil and auto industries) are far
more subtle. That makes them more dangerous. For example, here in
Minnesota, they passed a law a couple years ago that allowed NEVs on the
state's highways. But sneaked into that law was a provision that
"homebuilt NEVs can not be registered." Bang; you're dead! No more
low-speed hobby EVs.

Similarly, when Ford and GM wrote the rules for charging EVs in the 1997
NEC, they made sure it required their own proprietary charging systems.
Technically, almost all of our home charging installations violate code!
It's only because the code is so poorly enforced that we can get away
with it.

But what's going to happen if GM or Nissan decides that home EVs are
threating their EV business? They will lobby for tighter enforcement of
these existing codes. We're going to hear fear mongering, and loud calls
(with big campaign contributions) to ban anything but "approved"
charging. And, they will make darned sure that hobby EVs can't use
"their" chargers.

What I fear is that some law will be pushed through, under the radar,
that effectively bans home-built and small company EVs. It will be a
fact before the EV community even starts to respond. By then, it may be
too late! It would take millions of dollars of lobbying and a major
concerted effort of thousands of people to change it!

> I understand why Clare Bell writes SciFi about cats, after working
> with engineers ;-}

Thanks for my laugh of the day! :)

But I do find cats and engineers to be highly rational and self
consistent. They have their own internal rules, and they follow them.
The key to getting them to do something is to understand what is
motivating them, and work *with* it.
--
Lee A. Hart | Ring the bells that still can ring
814 8th Ave N | Forget the perfect offering
Sartell MN 56377 | There is a crack in everything
leeahart earthlink.net | That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen

_______________________________________________
| REPLYING: address your message to [email protected] only.
| Multiple-address or CCed messages may be rejected.
| UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub
| OTHER HELP: http://evdl.org/help/
| OPTIONS: http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
 
1 - 8 of 8 Posts
Top