[M3_MadBimmer]

Hello all,

My name is Luke. I'm 22 and reside in the suburbs of Chicago. I have been around cars since I can remember. I enjoy a nice project as the creativity is endless and the end result can be very rewarding.

I've mostly been into older BMW's and although i've owned 25+ cars since I've been 16 only 1 was something other than a bmw. I currently have a 95 and 98 m3. The 98 was a huge project i tackled and fabbed up a turbo system which yielded 604whp on 93 octane. From a 2.8L engine.


Here is a couple pics of the 98.

Anyways, I'm looking for a new project and that's what brought me here One of the cars I had in the past was a 1980 BMW 323i (euro spec.) I miss that car and have been thinking about getting another one to replace my current 95. Although this time I'd like to get a shell and go electric. The inspiration for this is the white zombie that I've seen videos of on youtube.


The project is a bit intimidating as my knowlege mostly consits of large fuel injectors, cutting and welding piping etc. I've never felt very confident with the wires...


I hope my stay at this forum will yield some gained knowledge. I'll try not to ask too many newb questions and will mostly focus on reading/searching for now.


Cheers!

Luke G.

 

[Woodsmith]

Welcome to the forum.

I reckon you should read Crodriver's thread. It should interest you.

 

[toddshotrods]

Welcome to the forum!

Are you familar with CroDriver's BiMoto BMW project?

And, the White Zombie's website?

There are a handful of us around here chasing performance with electric propulsion, including me.

I would suggest starting with hard numbers. Lay out your performance goals, and budget (time, money, human resources, etc) and then you'll get better advice and help from the other members. There's everything from lawnmowers to grocery getters, to race cars around here, all in one big happy bunch, so you have to ask pointed, specific, questions to get relevant answers. Make it really clear what you're looking for, and what you're willing/able to go through to get it.

Most importantly, have fun!

Darn it Woody you beat me by two minutes ^^^ what he said!

 

[Woodsmith]

Darn it Woody you beat me by two minutes!

That's what women usually say


Todd's thread is well worth a look, maybe a different style of ride but the goals will be familiar.

 

[M3_MadBimmer]

thanks for the warm welcome guys!

I will check the build, thanks!


As far as numbers here are my thoughts.

I'm hoping to have the car weigh in at about 1800-2000lbs. With about $10k to spend on the EV conversion i'd like to get as much power as possible within the budget. I honestly have no clue what all the different components may cost so I may be way off on the numbers. I'm hoping around 300hp should be plenty of fun, but if more is possible that would be great

 

[toddshotrods]

thanks for the warm welcome guys!

I will check the build, thanks!


As far as numbers here are my thoughts.

I'm hoping to have the car weigh in at about 1800-2000lbs. With about $10k to spend on the EV conversion i'd like to get as much power as possible within the budget. I honestly have no clue what all the different components may cost so I may be way off on the numbers. I'm hoping around 300hp should be plenty of fun, but if more is possible that would be great

Unless you just have an incredible surplus of time to burn, you might be wise to start at the back of my thread and work your way back in time to see how it got there.


Honestly, $10K isn't going to buy a lot in the way of serious performance. You'll spend most of that on a motor, controller, wiring, etc; and still be lacking the most expensive item - a battery pack. To get sports car type performance, and come in at or under 2000lbs, you're going to need a lithium pack and that could eat up or seriously exceed $10K by itself.

How about some more specific performance goals. How will you use the car? Is it for street, track, aggressive driving, full competition, etc.? ANy hard performance numbers you are seeking, or cars with comparable performance?

 

[M3_MadBimmer]

A peppy daily driver is what i'm looking for. I would like it to have at least a 80 mile range and be able to be recharged via 110v outlet if possible. It would be nice if it could roast the rear tires a bit and maybe take it to the drag strip every once in a while and get a 12,xx 1/4 mile...


dreams for $10k?



Maybe i'll move to a motorcycle frame. You guys have any thoughts on the new brammo empulse?

 

[toddshotrods]

A peppy daily driver is what i'm looking for. I would like it to have at least a 80 mile range and be able to be recharged via 110v outlet if possible. It would be nice if it could roast the rear tires a bit and maybe take it to the drag strip every once in a while and get a 12,xx 1/4 mile...


dreams for $10k?



Maybe i'll move to a motorcycle frame. You guys have any thoughts on the new brammo empulse?

I'll let some of the other guys chime in, but it might be possible. I thought you wanted to race. 12-sec quarter mile times would probably be asking a lot. $10K in a bike, on the other hand, would be a fun bike! I like the Brammo, sweet!

 

[rillip3]

A peppy daily driver is what i'm looking for. I would like it to have at least a 80 mile range and be able to be recharged via 110v outlet if possible. It would be nice if it could roast the rear tires a bit and maybe take it to the drag strip every once in a while and get a 12,xx 1/4 mile...


dreams for $10k?



Maybe i'll move to a motorcycle frame. You guys have any thoughts on the new brammo empulse?

80 miles is very possible on your budget, but only if you get out and push the car a lot. If you want it to move under its own power, not so much. A ballpark figure for ye olde car is 300 wh/mi. 80 mi x 300wh/mi = 24,000. At your price range, lithium is out, so the best you can do is AGM. 24,000 is at an ideal world with no losses. Include an extra 20% for the Peukert effect (losses do to how quickly you are pulling the energy out) and 20% to keep your batteries healthy (100% Depth of Discharge is a killer on them), you actually need 34,560 wh. At 144 v (highish for DC but still normal) you're looking at 240 Ah batteries. These weight about 2,000 lbs (1,984 based on a 48v 300 kg battery I just found poking around the internet. There may be better or worse available, but it sounds about right based on my batteries) and would cost $485 each at a bulk discount for 12. So that's $5,820 +s/h , which would be pretty expensive for 2,000 lbs of batteries.

With a large lithium pack, 80 mi is doable, but you just don't have the weight available in your average car for more than about 40 on lead-acid. And these batteries are gigantic, you would probably have to build a seat out of them to get them all to fit.

If you went for AC, you can get much smaller batteries, but you need more of them. Say a 360v pack, you'd only need 34560/360 = 96 Ah batteries. Even these are going to be more than 60 lbs a piece, however, and you'd need 30 of them, so still in the 1800 lb range, and at around $170 ea, you're looking at $5,100 +s/h. Not that big a savings, and AC drive systems are notoriously more expensive than DC.

There's an axiom that goes around here: you can have range, speed and low cost, but you can only pick two. I read an article today that the prices of lithium batteries may drop as much as 25%, so maybe in a few years, if the prices keep dropping, you could get lithium on a better budget, but for right now, 80 mi is just out of range of a budget build.

 

[toddshotrods]

I think rillip 3 meant to say 80 mile range is NOT possible, in his opening line.

Maybe a Warp 9 and 144v lithium pack would work? With a 144v lithium pack, and keeping the transmission, it should feel peppy enough. I still don't think 12-second 1/4s and 80 mile range are possible with it though. Either of those takes a more substantial investment. Combine them and you have to dig deep.

 

[GizmoEV]

Hi Luke,

Just to give you an idea I put a 12.8KWh pack in my Gizmo (www.evalbum.com/1328) and I have an 80 mile range. I spent over $5000 on this battery pack back in October, 2009. My car uses about 140Wh/mi. The total vehicle weight is 830lbs and only goes 49mph on level road with no wind. Compared to other Gizmos this is a sports car. If you only have a budget of $10000 then I would recommend building the motorcycle. Besides, you will gain a significant amount of experience which you could apply to a future car conversion.

Another place to look for information is evdl.org. The archive has a significant amount of information. Between there and here you should be good to go on plenty of reading.

David

 

[M3_MadBimmer]

Alright thanks for the information guys. I had no idea I would be adding so much weight with just the battery. I thought total battery weight would be around 500lbs max. Just shows how much of a noob I am.


I think my EV experience may start with the purchase of a Brammo and go from there. Get a bit more familiar with the system, and then maybe tackle a project.

 

[toddshotrods]

Alright thanks for the information guys. I had no idea I would be adding so much weight with just the battery. I thought total battery weight would be around 500lbs max. Just shows how much of a noob I am.


I think my EV experience may start with the purchase of a Brammo and go from there. Get a bit more familiar with the system, and then maybe tackle a project.

Yeah, a five hundred pound battery that has good performance potential is pretty expensive. White Zombie's new Kokam pack comes in around that weight, and the pack I have planned for my street rod is also about five hundred pounds. Those are both extreme performance packs, and probably $25K minimum, out to $50-60K+, to emulate. You'd need at least $10K worth of batteries to have anything remotely performance-oriented in a car or small truck, and then the range wouldn't meet your goals. The performance is available now, but it ain't cheap...

The thought of spending the $10K on a Brammo is very enticing, indeed!

 

[M3_MadBimmer]

The thought of spending the $10K on a Brammo is very enticing, indeed!

It really is, especially after coming here and getting a wake up on costs of components!


I think the 100 mile range, 100mph top speed out of the brammo for $13,900 is pretty good! I might have to visit the production plant for some in person reviews before I place my deposit though. I do not like buying sight unseen.