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Re: [EVDL] j1772 necessity revisited, "Conspiracy against new EVs?

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Re: [EVDL] j1772 necessity revisited, "Conspiracy against new EVs?

Hello Dennis,

It may be that EV's and ICE's will share the same garage and or auto repair =

facilities for a while. It=92s a safety thing where the EV input power cab=
les =

has to be arc proof in these locations because of gasoline fumes.

In all auto repair garages, aircraft hangers, fueling areas, and even in my =

garage all electrical devices must be Class 1, Division 1 below 4 feet. =

Above 4 feet all electrical items must be arc proof and in Mema 12 =

enclosures and above 12 feet can be standard Nema 1 enclosures.

One example of a portable high pressure sprayer unit that rolls around the =

floor below the 4 foot height, is that all the electrical items on this =

cleaning unit must be Class I, Division 1 which is normally all cast alloy =

electrical enclosures and totally enclose motor. The plug made by Chrose =

Hines company is install at the four foot height. The ground pin is shorte=
r =

then the line pins, so when the the plug is inserted into the receptacle =

which looks just like a standard industrial duty 120 VAC 20 amp 3 wire =

receptacle, but it does not energized the receptacle until the line pins =

make first and than the ground make last which pushes on a switch.

When we get into a higher ampere load for these types of Class 1 Division 1 =

or Division 2 areas, the cost goes way up. In aircraft repair hangers, =

which is also Class 1, Division 1 areas which is cause by fuel fumes and or =

leaking fuel which I have seen is very common in these areas.

In stead of running the aircraft up for accessory electrical power, we use =

ground power units that plug into 50 to 200 amp receptacles that are also =

place 4-foot above the floor. The housing of these receptacles may be =

classified as a Class 1, Division 2 enclosure or a Nema 12 totally enclosed =

enclosure above 4 foot.

These plug and receptacle enclosures happen to be manufacture by the Power =

Anderson Co. which also manufactures EV DC plug and connectors for EV use.

These higher ampere units will have a isolated ground system which will =

require a isolated transformer, a ground detection system and the power =

shall be turn on or off by the operator only at the load source for a =

emergency shut down.

We have paid up to $8000.00 for the 200 amp unit which was assembly by the =

Power Anderson Co. back in the 80's. So the cost today has to be more than =

double that. Later we purchase factory unassembled units directly from the =

manufacture that supply the components for these power receptacles which =

cost us about $4000.00

To make up one of these power outlets, we use either a Chrose Hinds cast =

aluminum Class 1 Division 1 enclosures or a Hoffman Nema 12 Enclosure if =

mounted above four feet. A size 4 200 amp ac contactor with line voltage =

coil, a 10 amp 1 pole 480 vac circuit breaker, a 50 va 480/24 vac control =

transformer, a 480 AC 10 amp relay with a 24 vac coil and a Power Anderson =

cable and plug set.

The power cord is a 6 wire where there is 3 power lines, one neutral and on=
e =

ground. There is two control pins that make last after the main pins make =

first. The control pins go to a switch on board the power units, that turn =

on the 24 volt relay which in turns turn on the 480 volt coil in the AC =


The units in the 50 amp size cost us over $500.00 factory cost back in the =



----- Original Message ----- =

From: "Dennis Miles" <[email protected]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2010 12:49 PM
Subject: [EVDL] j1772 necessity revisited, "Conspiracy against new EVs?

Would you buy an appliance if an outlet costing 15% of the price was
required to plug it in?

Price Gouging in the USA is highly frowned upon and in times of Emergency is
often illegal. We arrested and fined individuals after Hurricane Andrew in
Miami and Katrina in New Orleans for selling portable electric generators
for premium prices of two to ten times the usual.

Why then are we allowing dozens of firms all over the USA to charge the
American Public *twenty times the usual price* for an electric outlet and
installing it in their garage? Requiring citizens to waste $2,750 more than

What am I talking about? The so called =93Charging Stations=94 being insta=
in the homes of every individual who wants to buy a =93Plug-In =93electric
vehicle. An Electric or Hybrid Plug-In Vehicle is required to have a
=93Specialized Outlet=94 to connect the charging unit actually located in t=
Vehicle. WHY ?

In every home laundry area are two outlets, one is for the Washer it is 120
v. @ 15 a. and there are dozens of outlets all around your home just like
that (Stated simply, If you can plug in a Toaster, you can usually plug in
an EV.)The other one is for the Electric Dryer it is 208 to 240 v. @ 30 a. =

you own a Recreational Camper those come with a cord that plugs right in to
one or the other, but if you get a new Electric Vehicle, you must buy a
$3,000 socket and cord set and pay an additional $1,000 TO $2,000 to have it
installed. However to add an additional Dryer Outlet only costs about $250
including the parts needed.

Why then does an EV need a $5,000 outlet? Because, the Underwriter=92s
Laboratory said it? That is not reasonable. The only justification is
Safety, but I can plug a $300,000 RV bus into a =93Dryer Outlet=94 and the
10,000 plug-in vehicles in the USA today can plug into a =93dryer outlet=94=
or a
=93Standard home outlet=94 So that argument is unsubstantiated. If there =
concern to have a =93Ground Fault=94 protection, build it into the car. Tha=
t is
the proven method with Recreational Vehicles like Motor-homes.

IMHO, the j1772 connection is inhibiting the public adoption of Electric
"Plug-In" Vehicles. I ask "Why should we pay to have data collected
regarding our habits? Let the utilities pay , Why should we pay for this
Data collection so the "Charging Station" companies can then SELL the data
to the electric Utilities? The Idea does not sit well with me. Do you Like
it ? ? ?

-- =

*Dennis Lee Miles* (Director) *E.V.T.I. inc*.
*www.E-V-T-I-Inc.COM <> *(Adviser)*
EVTI-EVAEducation Chapter
Phone (813) ID4 - E V T I or (813) 434 - 3884
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