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Discussion Starter #1
Re: [EVDL] New Low Cost... flying car

Oh, but at least you can (could?) buy a flying car. (Not all electric,
unfortunately.) As I recall, it was priced similar to some of the hyped
"ready for mass production" EVs we've been reading about. <g>

From: "Danny Miller" <[email protected]>
> Still waiting for my flying car.
>
> Danny

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Discussion Starter #3
Re: [EVDL] New Low Cost... flying car

hey there is a guy in Davis, CA that has a flying car, its ready for
production, just needs some more investors, the last few's millions are
already gone. http://www.moller.com/

Michael Perry wrote:
> Oh, but at least you can (could?) buy a flying car. (Not all electric,
> unfortunately.) As I recall, it was priced similar to some of the hyped
> "ready for mass production" EVs we've been reading about. <g>
>
> From: "Danny Miller" <[email protected]>
>
>>Still waiting for my flying car.
>>
>>Danny
>
>
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Discussion Starter #4
Re: [EVDL] New Low Cost... flying car

The Moller is neither electric nor "low cost".

Which means it's both off topic and doesn't match the subject line.

That said, as cool as the vehicle is, I'd bet that he dies of old age
before he ever get's it to market. Too many issues that are unrelated to
the technology.

Aside from the regulatory issues, it uses way to much energy for the
desired effect. (i.e. getting from point A to point B)

I'd bet that any successfully marketed electric aero vehicles will be
light weight airplanes/gliders or possibly blimps/derigibles.
Gyrocopters would make a cool STOL EAV, but as I understand it under
certain situations they can have some dangerously counter-intuative
handling characteristics.


> hey there is a guy in Davis, CA that has a flying car, its ready for
> production, just needs some more investors, the last few's millions are
> already gone. http://www.moller.com/
>
> Michael Perry wrote:
>> Oh, but at least you can (could?) buy a flying car. (Not all electric,
>> unfortunately.) As I recall, it was priced similar to some of the hyped
>> "ready for mass production" EVs we've been reading about. <g>
>>
>> From: "Danny Miller" <[email protected]>
>>
>>>Still waiting for my flying car.
>>>
>>>Danny
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>>
>
>
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--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.

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Discussion Starter #5
Re: [EVDL] New Low Cost... flying car

Ha you don't have even a piece of it. See Moller takes in tens of
millions in private investments in sales of private, unregulated stock.
I saw a 2004 figure of $70 million spent. Actually there have been some
spin-off inventions that have the potential to make some real money, but
essentially it's a money pit. His promises of a flying car are absurdly
distant, the FAA doesn't even have a category for this one, it could
take some 10 yrs to get a certification system going even if you had
practical, working models today. The FAA would probably never allow
automated flights by non-pilots like he describes. Let alone the
technical specs promised seem to defy physics (I know something about
ducted fan design, they seem "unlikely").

But the part I wanted to relate is he's been promising "just about ready
for mass production" for at least 10 yrs. I talked to them where they
were ready to mass-produce their rotary engines at least, cheap too,
"sometime in the first quarter of next year". Talked about having lab
prototypes running for thousands of hours without fail, good efficiency,
low emissions, crazy lightweight for the power. That was, yeah, about
10 years ago. I've heard rumors a few prototypes made it out but don't
know of any mass production or buyable product. Let alone the Skycar- I
saw an interview from maybe 2000 where he's sitting beside a glossy
mock-up saying "if someone wants to come up with a million dollars, we
can get you a Skycar built in six months". Right, a few years back they
hovered a tethered prototype of unknown weight a few feet off the ground
briefly. Actually that IS remarkable, Moller is indeed a smary guy,
just far from a practical device and completely out of line with their
claims.

Actually when I said "ready for mass-production" is a phrase used almost
exclusively by fraudsters, Moller's Skycar was the FIRST and foremost
idea in my mind!

Danny

R Patterson wrote:

>Moeller
>
>They were taking deposits of $10,000 about 20 years ago ... a working
>prototype was suppose to be delivered in 5yrs - they have tethered
>flight only to my knowledge.
>
>On 10/3/07, Michael Perry <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>>Oh, but at least you can (could?) buy a flying car. (Not all electric,
>>unfortunately.) As I recall, it was priced similar to some of the hyped
>>"ready for mass production" EVs we've been reading about. <g>
>>
>>From: "Danny Miller" <[email protected]>
>>
>>
>>>Still waiting for my flying car.
>>>
>>>Danny
>>>
>>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>For subscription options, see
>>http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
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>>
>>
>
>
>
>

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Discussion Starter #6
Re: [EVDL] New Low Cost... flying car

You mean that thing I see on the cover of Popular Mechanics every 2-3
years or so?

Jack Murray wrote:
> hey there is a guy in Davis, CA that has a flying car, its ready for
> production, just needs some more investors, the last few's millions are
> already gone. http://www.moller.com/
>
> Michael Perry wrote:
> > Oh, but at least you can (could?) buy a flying car. (Not all electric,
> > unfortunately.) As I recall, it was priced similar to some of the hyped
> > "ready for mass production" EVs we've been reading about. <g>
> >
> > From: "Danny Miller" <[email protected]>
> >
> >>Still waiting for my flying car.
> >>
> >>Danny
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > For subscription options, see
> > http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev

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Discussion Starter #7
Re: [EVDL] New Low Cost... flying car

--
Actually when I said "ready for mass-production" is a phrase used almost
exclusively by fraudsters, Moller's Skycar was the FIRST and foremost
idea in my mind!
--

This may be an off-topic thread but the Moller story probably relates a lot
to Amectran (Exar-1).


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Discussion Starter #9
Re: [EVDL] New Low Cost... flying car

R Patterson wrote:
> Now with some super conducting field coils, a cryogenic cooled rotor,
> light weight motor housing, and some yet to be developed weightless
> batteries [or better yet a portable fusion generator (fusor)] we could
> have an awesome aero-EV.

This is why one of my favorite aphorisms is that the Perfect is the
enemy of the Good.

Nothing is perfect. When someone promises you a perfect solution, look
out for the sales pitch! All he has is a perfect way to extract money
from your wallet!

The irresistible lure for perfection can be a good thing -- it is
hopeful, optimistic; it excites and inspires us, and drives us forward.
But, it also has a dark side. People will ignore perfectly good
solutions today, and instead throw their time and money away in the
pursuit of perfection in some vague tomorrow. They wind up with nothing;
neither the good solution, nor the perfect one.

This is how I see EVs. Most people do nothing but wait for someone else
to develop the perfect solution -- it never comes, of course. Some think
they can get rich by investing in the "perfect" battery or motor or
whatever -- but their money will just be squandered and lost to people
who are big on promises but weak on results.

Real EVs will come from a third group; the tiny minority that puts their
time and money into *good* solutions -- the ones we already have today,
that we can actually buy and put to work right now. They aren't perfect;
but they're better than nothing! More importantly, investments in good
solutions really *do* move the field forward. They get EVs on the road,
they encourage pioneers to keep exploring, and they finance new
businesses to produce more.
--
There's a cartoon that shows a city street full of people. All of them
have a stick taped to their back that arches forward over their heads. A
carrot is hanging from each stick, just out of their reach. Everyone is
madly racing forward, trying to reach their own personal carrot. Except
one man, who is peeing on the carrot.
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net

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Discussion Starter #10
Re: [EVDL] New Low Cost... flying car

Danny wrote -


>> Still waiting for my flying car.
>>
>> Danny
>

Hey Danny!

Check out a site I made for my father who helped to produce a flying car,
the Airphibian, after WWII. It even got approved by the FAA and had an N
number.

www.Airphibian.com

Rush
Tucson, AZ
www.ironandwood.org
www.Airphibian.com
www.TEVA2.com

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