[trustpete2]

Hi All,

I just finish converting a Suzuki Carry 4x4 mini truck using a old 72v 10kw max brushless motor and a Kelly KLS7250NC controller with a 2.9kwh battery pack. I have had it running for about 2 months, getting 25 km per charge and done over 500 km.

I'm so pleased with the Carry that I am looking at converting a 2007 Suzuki Jimny using a Kelly HPQ10-96 AC Induction Motor 96V 20KW max ( HPQ10-96 AC Induction Motor 96V 10KW - Kelly Controls ) coupled to the gear box with matching controller and making 2 battery packs using BYD blade cells with a combined capacity of 21kwh (running batteries @ 80% capacity). Sorry I don't have an actual pic but it looks like this one. The Carry weight 780kg before the conversion and the Jimny weights 1080kg

Now to the real reason to write all this, has any one converted a Jimny if so what are your thoughts and I am open to any ideas.

 

[remy_martian]

Am curious about what kind of speed you got out of the Carry?

 

[trustpete2]

4th gear 68km/h, 5th gear is only about 5km/h faster but not as much grunt, I have pulled about 1000kg in 1st gear and my dad pulled about 1500kg in 4th low both weights were on gravel roads with hills

 

[remy_martian]

impressive

 

[Seb34567]

Hi, I'm starting the same conversion (carry) but with a '90 Mazda scrum.

I was looking for comparative and you posted right that, thx!

Mine will be with a 7.7kwh 72v pack and a ac34 Curtis motor. But seeing what you state maybe I will go lower with a golden motor 20kw instead...

I should order the motor this week.

It will be used on steep hills everyday in the summer. What are the spec of your motor? It seems bigger than a 10ke max. When climbing a steep hill with maybe half a load, what speed do you get?

Also, did you cancel your clutch?

Did you made by yourself the adapter plate?

Did you use a DC/DC converter or an accessory battery? Mine has the dumping box and I'm still thinking about each way to make the 12V works.

Sorry, so many questions but it's difficult to find a successful conversion with anything else than DC motor on these Kei trucks.

Thx!

 

[Seb34567]

I dream often about a Jimny. I had many Samurais but here in Canada the Jimnys where banned because of a stupid lawsuit from Honda and Toyota.

I tried them in Iceland and in the south sun destinations. The spiritual successor of the Sammy...

I'm deeply jealous of you project lol. It will be really awesome!

 

[trustpete2]

Hi Seb,
This is a photo of the motor name plate.

We live on a farm on the west coast of NZ and it is very rugged country. Both loads we pulled were up about a 10 degree slope, speed up hill I was looking at my amps more that my speed, I think 1st gear 10 -15 km/h @ 160amp. I have used it for chasing cattle on our river bed paddocks which can be quite ruff and it did great, drawing 25 - 45 amps with 140kg on the deck.
We did pull out out the clutch but we wouldn't do that again. We used a DC/DC controller to a 12v battery.

In saying all that, if I was going on to the gear box all over again I would go with the 20kw for more speed on road. 10kw has lots of power for off road in low gear see this pic if in doubt on pulling power.

 

[trustpete2]

The Carry on the trailer is an other one we were looking at converting with a 20kw. The Carry's have a 60hp engine in them and combustion engines are only 20% efficient so do the math.

 

[remy_martian]

60hp is 60hp.

Efficiency loss from there is in the drivetrain.

That nameplate is showing 5kW continuous rating...

While your speeds in 1st gear seem plausible, I'm going to guess your ammeter is way off, though.

 

[trustpete2]

The amp reading is strate from the BMS and the Kelly controller is 140 amp continuous and 380 max but we have limited it 300 amp on the BMS.

 

[trustpete2]

Just wondering Remy just with our conversation why would our 5 kw continuous motor perform as good as the old petrol engine we had in it. As it our first conversation and we are planning to do more I would like to get my head around the concept

 

[remy_martian]

It's got me scratching my head.

The only things I can think of is there's either a black hole nearby that's pulling on it or a current sensing shunt got substituted.

Would be cool if you could safely get a clamp meter on there to validate the current readings.

 

[trustpete2]

Hi there guys.
I thought I would put my 2 cents worth in since my son is the one that has been doing the posts on my behalf. I am not so good with the writing.
I have been working with machinery for over 35 years - involved with mechanical engineering and building all sort of machinery and mechanical work on heavy industrial machines and worked a lot with diesels and petrols.
A lots of people put a lot of emphasis on Kw and horsepower but often underestimate how important torque is. Power is nothing without torque. So I think when you are looking to go electric it is something you need to take into consideration. And yes it is true, I agree with you. 60hp is 60hp. I did a bit more explaining to my son.
The thing you need to really concentrate on is what sort of thing you are looking for. Is it speed you are wanting and high performance or are you looking for low down torque where speed is not the issue or are you looking to get both speed and low down torque ??? that's when you will need a lot more horsepower with a good amount of torque.
There are a lot of variables to consider, and to clarify the Amperage, I have test everything I have done with an expensive clamp metre as well as what the BMS tells me.
Overall the outcome of what it does speaks for itself. I am very happy with it's performance. I am planning to do another 4. Which I know I can do improvements in.
I will explain, this is my lovely wife writing for me.
I have never done this sort of thing before, I'm a bit nervous - hope I have explained it well enough. I have really enjoyed working with EV conversions.

 

[trustpete2]

sorry I didn't see your post. It will be no problem to double check with clamp metre tomorrow. I just went back and read what my son Michael had written. He may have been a bit low on the amps.
Hopefully I can be a bit more accurate for you.

 

[Seb34567]

Hi Seb,
This is a photo of the motor name plate.
View attachment 128507
We live on a farm on the west coast of NZ and it is very rugged country. Both loads we pulled were up about a 10 degree slope, speed up hill I was looking at my amps more that my speed, I think 1st gear 10 -15 km/h @ 160amp. I have used it for chasing cattle on our river bed paddocks which can be quite ruff and it did great, drawing 25 - 45 amps with 140kg on the deck.
We did pull out out the clutch but we wouldn't do that again. We used a DC/DC controller to a 12v battery.

In saying all that, if I was going on to the gear box all over again I would go with the 20kw for more speed on road. 10kw has lots of power for off road in low gear see this pic if in doubt on pulling power.
View attachment 128509

Really impressive! Your numbers make me think a lot on the other projects I have. Like someone says here, torque is really the most important thing and the only one I did not calculate when designing the conversion. I could have saved a lot.

I'm going forward with a custom made kit from a seller here in Canada (canev).

It's really pricey (20k$cad)... But I got 3 sponsors and a grant. It will be the Curtis ac34 and a 7.7kwh pack (24 cells + room for 12 others when they get them back in stock).

It's way overbuilt comparing to yours... I will give the numbers when it will be rolling.

Since it has the dump bed, we will extend the rear subframe to place the pack between the cab and the bed.

I'll see the fitting possibilities with/without clutch when delivered.

Mine is older than yours ('90) and it's not the same transmission and gearings. I have two '98 with blown engine, I will probably try the two different transmission to find the best combo.

 

[remy_martian]

Power is speed times torque. You can't make speed if the torque is not there. So, you are sort of right about torque, but there is a reason for the focus on kW and HP...

A transmission or gearbox or belt/chain transfers power. Nearly 100% - the rest of the energy is lost, mostly as heat. So the gearbox/trans/chain/belt can give you more torque at an output speed...but only if the HP or kW is there.

 

[brian_]

Just wondering ... why would our 5 kw continuous motor perform as good as the old petrol engine we had in it.

Because you are pushing it (applying enough voltage at a high enough motor speed, resulting in enough current) to produce far more than 5 kilowatts. And if you were shifting the transmission to keep the engine speed very low, the engine would have been unable to produce anything close to its rated power.

300 amps at 72 volts is 21.6 kW, not 5 kW; even 160 amps at 72 volts is 11.5 kW. Of course those are input power to motor, but even at only 80% efficiency that would be 17 kW and 9.2 kW. When the BMS sees more than 300 amps, does it shut off the main contactor, or is there some sort of communication with the controller? I'm wondering how the BMS limits battery discharge current.

 

[brian_]

The Carry's have a 60hp engine in them and combustion engines are only 20% efficient so do the math.

What math? The 60 horsepower rating is for engine output. Efficiency determines the rate of energy input that is required by engine to produce that output, but whether the efficiency is high or low has no relevance to the output.

 

[Electric Land Cruiser]

A "5kw" motor running at 21kw is reasonable. And yes the Kei truck's engine is very small and spinning near max rpm to make 60hp and also most of it's torque so there is probably quite a bit of area in the powerband where the electric motor makes more power and torque than the gas motor. As far living on a farm in NZ with electric trucks, just color me a little jealous.

 

[Electric Land Cruiser]

And yes KW and HP are not really directly comparable except outside of the peak rating. For instance an electric motor can pull very high amperage at very low RPM which equals high KW and high torque. But high torque at low RPM is still low HP so in that example the KW and HP are not comparable.