The EV Motorhome
Hi;
As a former Electronics engineer and Computer systems specialist now living in a Motorhome full time my ambition is to convert this rig to full electric. Nothing is started yet in the real conversion other than design of the some of the new dash electronics.
Dropping a line of intro to the forum to say hello and wish you all well in your own ventures.
As a former Electronics engineer and Computer systems specialist now living in a Motorhome full time my ambition is to convert this rig to full electric. Nothing is started yet in the real conversion other than design of the some of the new dash electronics.
Dropping a line of intro to the forum to say hello and wish you all well in your own ventures.
1 - 20 of 75 Posts
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I don't think anyone's ever actually done it, but about once a month someone stops by here to ask about the logistics of an EV motorhome.
Happy for you to be the first to get one built.
Happy for you to be the first to get one built.
Lots of logistics to work out. but I have been toying with idea since 2014 because for second time in two years I had trouble starting the ICE fuel injected stuff. First time they pumped out the gas and refilled with fresh stuff with cleaner in it and fought for two days to get the pumps to supply fuel. That hit me hard at $900. Motorhome ran perfect after that right up till campground sent message they were closing and everyone had to be out in 30 days. For 28 days I fought trying to get fuel to the motor and finally had to pay $1800 to have this heavy rig towed. Mechanic where I am now says drop and empty tank, replace the in-tank pump and the in-line pump on the rail and all the fuel lines. The 460 motor has 67000 original miles on it but is 24 years old.
Since I don't how to work on ICE fuel injection and gas prices keep shy-rocketing maybe it's time to bite the bullet and convert this rig once and for all. Design the electronics such that it can be duplicated into any vehicle of any size and programmed to have customized displays for taste.
At the time the first thing I found was lack of any consolidated info of vehicle masses, mass of engine and other parts to be removed. I have been off and on working on gathering info on cars, trucks, busses, and motorcoaches that identify the curb weights, motor type and mass. And a white paper on how infrastructure can be adapted to enable new businesses centered on supporting EV market can be accomplished.
You said you hear from time to time about others that think of but never bring to fruition their plans, and I am not surprised when I see how much info is missing and how the hurtles placed from some businesses make it hard on diy. My case in point is that TM4 out of quebec has a series of direct drive motors that can be directly coupled to the rear axles of Busses, Semi tractors, Motorcoaches and other heavy vehicles with little to no effort but will only sell to corporate clients. No individuals can buy their product. If I were a much younger man I would be tempted to establish an EV transformation shop as a corporation as I see a good market for it.
I am known for doing what has never been done before and hope to continue in those efforts. Again good luck to all who venture the path less traveled.
Since I don't how to work on ICE fuel injection and gas prices keep shy-rocketing maybe it's time to bite the bullet and convert this rig once and for all. Design the electronics such that it can be duplicated into any vehicle of any size and programmed to have customized displays for taste.
At the time the first thing I found was lack of any consolidated info of vehicle masses, mass of engine and other parts to be removed. I have been off and on working on gathering info on cars, trucks, busses, and motorcoaches that identify the curb weights, motor type and mass. And a white paper on how infrastructure can be adapted to enable new businesses centered on supporting EV market can be accomplished.
You said you hear from time to time about others that think of but never bring to fruition their plans, and I am not surprised when I see how much info is missing and how the hurtles placed from some businesses make it hard on diy. My case in point is that TM4 out of quebec has a series of direct drive motors that can be directly coupled to the rear axles of Busses, Semi tractors, Motorcoaches and other heavy vehicles with little to no effort but will only sell to corporate clients. No individuals can buy their product. If I were a much younger man I would be tempted to establish an EV transformation shop as a corporation as I see a good market for it.
I am known for doing what has never been done before and hope to continue in those efforts. Again good luck to all who venture the path less traveled.
It appears that this application is for a motorhome used for long-term stays, so it rarely drives and always has utility power. I think it will be difficult to objectively justify an EV conversion for this purpose; switching to a trailer (for which a tow vehicle can be rented or borrowed or hired when required) is likely more practical.
If the current engine is a "460", it's presumably a Ford chassis with the last of the big-block V8 engines (the Ford 385 series), introduced for cars in the late 1960's and used in many applications, ending with some trucks and motorhomes. It was replaced for motorhome and pickup/medium-duty use by the 6.8 L Triton V10 that is in my motorhome. Although Ford does sell many crate engines (for racing), if someone wanted to build a vehicle with the 6.8, they couldn't buy it as a crate engine from Ford, because individuals just can't get everything they might want; it would be a salvage exercise, just as a single very large (by EV standards) electric motor will likely be.
While EV conversions of motorhomes are essentially non-existent in this forum, lots for "concept" and "prototype" electric motorhomes have been built. It's fundamentally not technically difficult - after all, it's just a truck (there are lots of electric trucks) with RV fittings in it. It's just expensive, and of limited functional value.
Component manufacturers can't take the time to support individual customers - most of whom are unprepared and unqualified to use the products - and don't want to risk the damage to their reputation from failed installations. This is the same situation regardless of the size of EV; there is good reason that DIY EV conversions now commonly use components salvaged from production EVs. It's even the same for engine swaps in conventional vehicles: while some engines are available in "crate" form, the practical way to get an engine for a vehicle that didn't come with it is to salvage one from a worn out or wrecked vehicle that had that engine from the factory.
If the current engine is a "460", it's presumably a Ford chassis with the last of the big-block V8 engines (the Ford 385 series), introduced for cars in the late 1960's and used in many applications, ending with some trucks and motorhomes. It was replaced for motorhome and pickup/medium-duty use by the 6.8 L Triton V10 that is in my motorhome. Although Ford does sell many crate engines (for racing), if someone wanted to build a vehicle with the 6.8, they couldn't buy it as a crate engine from Ford, because individuals just can't get everything they might want; it would be a salvage exercise, just as a single very large (by EV standards) electric motor will likely be.
Lots of people have seen a market for conversions; most of the their businesses have failed. The most likely to stay in business are those that avoid capital investment by doing only custom conversions, not trying to produce some sort of converted product. While they are not available everywhere, there are lots of companies still doing this. Sure, a large motorhome would be an unusual project, but since these conversion companies have no production line or product, they could do a motorhome as easily as any other random new model project... as long as they can get a big enough motor. We've discussed the questions of how big and how many motors for a motorhome in other threads in this forum.If I were a much younger man I would be tempted to establish an EV transformation shop as a corporation as I see a good market for it.
I am known for doing what has never been done before and hope to continue in those efforts. Again good luck to all who venture the path less traveled.
While EV conversions of motorhomes are essentially non-existent in this forum, lots for "concept" and "prototype" electric motorhomes have been built. It's fundamentally not technically difficult - after all, it's just a truck (there are lots of electric trucks) with RV fittings in it. It's just expensive, and of limited functional value.
Yes my application right now is long term stays but is anticipated to progress into more travelling. I have done the whole travel trailer behind truck and fifth wheel behind truck methods. The one ton chevy (gas) and the limited storage of a travel trailer left much to be desired. Booting around town in a truck or even worse commuting with it was expensive both in gas and maintenance. Moving to the fifth wheel pulled by a f250 diesel just multiplied the problems. The first motorcoach was a bounder classic which was warm year round but tanks weren't accessible or heated and parts were non-existant locally. The Coachmen with a ford V10 was never meant for use except in warmest months of year. The two motor coaches had the major plus in that they could tow a vehicle to commute with. Enter my current motor coach.
1994 Gulfstream sunscreen 2000 : Ford F53 chassis, 460 fuel injected engine. 2 fuel pumps (1 in tank) 75gal tank
34 foot coach with 3 coach battery, 2 chassis batteries, 10 heated storage bays that go all the way accross.
80 lb propane tank & propane fired 3500 watt generator (I installed this to replace 1200 watt gas generator)
17000 lb GVWR, 24000 lb GCWR, 10900 lb curb weight & infinitely rebuildable.
Fuel non-economy is barely 4 mpg city 5 mpg hiway
At this point I have not been able to accertain what the tranmission is or the rear drive ratio. With the fuel supply problems it has cost me $4450 to travel 190 kms or to put it another way $22 per km. Imagine if fuel problems persist and I have to continue to move just 12 times at the same rate as the previous 4 moves can I justify spending $13350 for 570 kms or am I better to spend $15000 for free dependable travel (because you get power for free in your campground stall rent).
I have designed the new dash and computerized controller and purchased the electronics parts to make the same $400. To this I need to improve the braking system, Modify the heating/cooling system, Remove the gas tank and fuel lines so that I can modify
the bins behind the rear wheels to accomodate 40" x 96" x 22" of battery storage space for bms monitored lithium ion cells.
Delete the engine and probably the transmission in favor of a correctly sized electric motor and gearbox.
I may be crazy but it makes sense to me to reduce dependance on reworked old cost prohibitive fossil fuel technology.
1994 Gulfstream sunscreen 2000 : Ford F53 chassis, 460 fuel injected engine. 2 fuel pumps (1 in tank) 75gal tank
34 foot coach with 3 coach battery, 2 chassis batteries, 10 heated storage bays that go all the way accross.
80 lb propane tank & propane fired 3500 watt generator (I installed this to replace 1200 watt gas generator)
17000 lb GVWR, 24000 lb GCWR, 10900 lb curb weight & infinitely rebuildable.
Fuel non-economy is barely 4 mpg city 5 mpg hiway
At this point I have not been able to accertain what the tranmission is or the rear drive ratio. With the fuel supply problems it has cost me $4450 to travel 190 kms or to put it another way $22 per km. Imagine if fuel problems persist and I have to continue to move just 12 times at the same rate as the previous 4 moves can I justify spending $13350 for 570 kms or am I better to spend $15000 for free dependable travel (because you get power for free in your campground stall rent).
I have designed the new dash and computerized controller and purchased the electronics parts to make the same $400. To this I need to improve the braking system, Modify the heating/cooling system, Remove the gas tank and fuel lines so that I can modify
the bins behind the rear wheels to accomodate 40" x 96" x 22" of battery storage space for bms monitored lithium ion cells.
Delete the engine and probably the transmission in favor of a correctly sized electric motor and gearbox.
I may be crazy but it makes sense to me to reduce dependance on reworked old cost prohibitive fossil fuel technology.
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To help narrow the conversation:
- What's your budget?
- What do you need for range?
- What do you need for speed?
I suspect when you answer those questions, we'll end up talking you out of the conversion, same as almost everyone else has. But, knock your socks off. I'd be happy to see you be the first.
- What's your budget?
- What do you need for range?
- What do you need for speed?
I suspect when you answer those questions, we'll end up talking you out of the conversion, same as almost everyone else has. But, knock your socks off. I'd be happy to see you be the first.
Wow, that fuel consumption is stupendously bad. You could probably save both fuel and total operating cost by just removing the engine and towing it (with a heavy-duty tow truck) when you want to move. Our 37-foot motorhome on a 2008 F53 22,000 lb GVWR chassis uses not much more half that amount of fuel, with the V10 and 4R100 transmission.
The current transmission doesn't matter unless you plan to keep it in the conversion (probably more trouble than it's worth). If you do keep it, the transmission doesn't matter much because any transmission has enough ratios and any automatic is an expensive hassle. But if you are keeping it... I doubt there was every any choice in F53 transmissions. In 1994, it appeared to use the E4OD (electronically controlled 4-speed with overdrive top gear) version of the Ford C6 transmission (the stronger of the two automatics Ford had for trucks at the time), although I suppose it's possible it still had the hydraulically-controlled original C6 (a 1994 is too old to have the final "4R100" version of the C6 series). Just make sure that the torque converter can be locked up for efficiency; an original C6 does not include a torque converter lockup clutch, but an E4OD does.
If you want a multi-speed transmission for performance, a swap to a manual would be easier and more efficient... except that the shift linkage would be a problem.
Since this is a Ford F53 chassis, you might find the Motiv EPIC chassis interesting: it is an electric vehicle chassis line based on an Ford gliders (no engine or transmission); the F53-based version has been used by Winnebago for a prototype special-purpose vehicle (like a motorhome, but not used as an RV because it doesn't have enough range).
I doubt that you can make an acceptable vehicle of this size for $15K, but as you get further into planning you'll see.
Campground power isn't free; you pay substantially more for a 50-amp (@240V) site than for a lower-power site, and more for a low-power site than for an unserviced site. True, by sucking as much power as you can for a whole night you can be subsidized by other people using a more reasonable amount of energy. Seasonal (paid by the month) campsites usually meter and charge for power separately, rather than including it in the rent.
The axle is presumably a Dana 80, and probably has a tag on it which can be interpreted to provide the final drive ratio. The chassis information placard (which should be found stuck somewhere in the interior near the driver's seat) which shows the GVWR and GAWR should also have an axle code; again, it won't directly list the final drive ratio, but the code can be looked up to provide that.
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Your budget is too small by a factor of four - and I am one of the most "Scottish" builders on this site!
100 Km at highway speed with a muckle great RV will need more than 200 kwh of battery
At $200/kwh (the cheapest batteries - second hand from a scrapped EV) that works out as $40,000 - for the battery
Before we talk motors, chargers, controllers
It's good to understand the goals
... but a 100 km range in which I must find a suitable and available campground would completely destroy my enjoyment of travelling. I doubt I would be comfortable with the assumption that a suitable campground exists within 75 km of the previous campground even here in central Alberta; head out across the prairies, or up north, or into the mountains, or across northern Ontario, and I would be studying maps and doing web searches more than I would be driving.I'll note that the range of a vehicle on Motiv's F53 electric chassis is longer than 100 km, and Winnebago's assessment is that it is not long enough to be useful for a motorhome. That doesn't mean it won't work for you, only that the limitation is very important to the way the vehicle can be used.
I get nervous about range when I have only 200 km of fuel left in the tank of my motorhome... and I only need to find a gas station, not a serviced campsite!
Not advocating it, but it would sort of work:
you can prabably get about 2,5kW of charging power from your generator, plus a bit of solar...so parking for a day could give you something like 30-35 miles range
can you get 1200-1500 kg of batteries (2400-3000 lbs?) under the floor? think size of 2x tesla 85-100 kWh pack.
It -can- be done if the vehicle can carry the batteries, but not an easy or cheap task. If you'd only need to go 20-30 Mph on flat surface and / or very short range you could start with a small battery. (motor could still be big enough for battery upgrades later) (small battery: 30-50 kWh, thermally managed)
you can prabably get about 2,5kW of charging power from your generator, plus a bit of solar...so parking for a day could give you something like 30-35 miles range
can you get 1200-1500 kg of batteries (2400-3000 lbs?) under the floor? think size of 2x tesla 85-100 kWh pack.
It -can- be done if the vehicle can carry the batteries, but not an easy or cheap task. If you'd only need to go 20-30 Mph on flat surface and / or very short range you could start with a small battery. (motor could still be big enough for battery upgrades later) (small battery: 30-50 kWh, thermally managed)
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Even if you could get it done for $15,000...
Let's presume worst case, you still only get 4mpg. That's 1.7km/L.
At a $1/L, that's 25,000 km of travel before you've paid off your batteries. Double that if you to 50,0000 km if you get the gas mileage that Brian says you should be getting. 8000km is coast to coast. If you're not commuting in the motorhome, that's a heck of a large amount of driving to break even.
Right now you're parked, but you'd like to travel more.
Traveling 75km per day isn't traveling very much. You can probably puddle jump around a few areas but you won't be going far, or often.
I think your best bet is to just spend a little bit of money fixing up or replacing your gas powerplant and continuing to use that.
Let's presume worst case, you still only get 4mpg. That's 1.7km/L.
At a $1/L, that's 25,000 km of travel before you've paid off your batteries. Double that if you to 50,0000 km if you get the gas mileage that Brian says you should be getting. 8000km is coast to coast. If you're not commuting in the motorhome, that's a heck of a large amount of driving to break even.
Right now you're parked, but you'd like to travel more.
Traveling 75km per day isn't traveling very much. You can probably puddle jump around a few areas but you won't be going far, or often.
I think your best bet is to just spend a little bit of money fixing up or replacing your gas powerplant and continuing to use that.
Carrying the weight of the battery is always a concern in EV design. Of course, this is already being considered:
Although big RVs are on truck chassis, so they look like they can carry a lot, they also tend to be carrying nearly their full allowed load (of a house, basically) when they leave the factory. A big battery could easily be too much, although of course the engine (and perhaps transmission) and some related systems are deleted, so only the net weight increase matters.
This particular case is strange. I'm surprised that a 34' motorhome weighs only 10,900 pounds, including fuel. My 37' motorhome probably has higher coach weight due to changes in typical RV practices over 20 years (for example, I have solid maple cabinet doors and two air conditioners), but still... it is almost twice this heavy.
Underfloor space can be an issue, as the RV usually has tanks (water, waste, propane, vehicle fuel), coach battery, a generator, and miscellanous hardware (such as a hydraulic leveling jack powerpack) all under the floor... along with the engine, transmission, propeller shaft (driveshaft), engine battery, cooling system, exhaust, and suspension. In a hybrid, space can run out quickly, but this is a proposal for a "pure" battery-electric vehicle. The electric motor plus controller/inverter and charger will be smaller than the engine (or engine plus transmission), leaving basically the fuel tank and exhaust spaces - plus anything that was previously unused) for battery. I wouldn't even consider sacrificing any storage space for EV equipment.
75 US gallons (the size of the stock fuel tank) is 284 litres... about the size of my fuel tank. In my case, this is basically a rectangular box about as wide as can fit between the frame rails, behind the rear axle. This is roughly the same as the volume of the smaller (14 module) Tesla Model S/X pack, but a different shape. Replacing that with a battery box makes good packaging sense, but it will be important to keep track of mass distribution to avoid rear axle overload - keep in mind that a battery pack is much heavier than a full fuel tank of the same volume. Commercially produced truck (and RV) conversions tend to locate battery packs between the frame rails and within the wheelbase (between the front and rear axles).
Placing battery packs forward of the rear axle makes the most sense for mass distribution, but the propeller shaft running right down the middle certainly makes the space less useful; that's one reason that a designed-from-scratch EV puts the motor at the driven axle, not at the other end of the vehicle. In most modern Class A motorhomes (including this one), storage compartments run across the unit under the floor but above the frame, greatly limiting the space available for battery in the middle of the unit.
If the motor can sit well back, ideally in the original transmission space, there will be space in the forward part of the original engine compartment. This is a good place for the mass, but it's not much volume compared to the needs of this large vehicle.
I like the idea of an electric motorhome/toy hauler - as I never travel more than 30-40 miles away from home for my hobbies. In regards to this thread, Smith Electric made a box truck that could either serve as a starting point for a conversion, or serve as a donor for everything electric. I believe some were outfitted with as high as 150kwh which would easily surpass your distance requirements. Here is an example of one for sale:
https://www.truckpaper.com/listings/trucks/for-sale/19003471/2010-smith-newton
https://www.truckpaper.com/listings/trucks/for-sale/19003471/2010-smith-newton
While the ad's spec of "SMITH 80KWH ELECTRIC ENGINE" makes no sense, the truck might have either
- an 80 kW motor (which would be inadequate for the motorhome), or
- an 80 kWh battery (which could be suitable, although not as large as desired)
The Wikipedia article for the Smith Newton lists a 120 kW motor and a choice of 80 kWh or 120 kWh batteries, so presumably this truck has an 80 kWh battery.
It seems like a better choice would be a Newton with the 120 kWh battery, if you could find one cheaply.I note that techwiz03 is in Alberta; it is unlikely that any truck like this could be found in Alberta, and it would be rare even in all of Canada. Importing one would likely be problematic.
I always have to wonder why low-mileage and apparently undamaged electric commercial vehicles are available... did they turn out to be not useful, do they have a failed battery, or did the business that owned it just go under?
Now for a dose of reality: the Newton can apparently only manage 80 km/h with a 120 kW motor. That's not fast enough to be safe on major highways, it's slow enough to frustrate other drivers on many two-lane highways, and taking indirect routes is problematic when range is limiting.
By the way, Smith was one of those many companies which factory-converted commercial vehicles (made by Ford and others) into EVs... then went broke.
I'd assumed whoever wrote the ad didn't fully understand the vehicle, and that it would have the 80kwh battery. For it to be useful it would definitely need to be able to maintain 60mph regardless of grade(in the US) so that is surprising to hear it can't! I see maybe 1 or 2/year pop up on the various auction website I frequent.
If the motorhome is worth keeping around - Swap in a 7.3L Powerstroke... 4BT cummins, 6BT cummins... lots of options that would be well under the $15k budget and properly tuned would achieve 15mpg or so. I don't know how a person could make electric work for that money... in the US salvage packs are still $80/kwh at best.
Eventually I'm guessing someone will take a Tesla semi, or Nikola (if they ever are produced) and build a "showhauler" or toterhome - Would be difficult to do for much less than $500k or so but sure will be cool!
If the motorhome is worth keeping around - Swap in a 7.3L Powerstroke... 4BT cummins, 6BT cummins... lots of options that would be well under the $15k budget and properly tuned would achieve 15mpg or so. I don't know how a person could make electric work for that money... in the US salvage packs are still $80/kwh at best.
Eventually I'm guessing someone will take a Tesla semi, or Nikola (if they ever are produced) and build a "showhauler" or toterhome - Would be difficult to do for much less than $500k or so but sure will be cool!
I agree. Vehicle ads routinely have errors, claiming engine and transmission combinations which were never offered, and the advertiser doesn't bother to check that the ad is correct; an ad for an EV is even more likely to be wrong.
Most commercial vehicles - with diesel engines - can't maintain anything close to 60 mph on substantial grades. On an 8% grade (common in mountain passes), you're lucky to get 30 mph out of a loaded big rig. As a first approximation, a 40-ton (80,000 lb or 36,000 kg) truck would require about 770 kW (1033 hp) to just raise the mass up the slope, in addition to the power needed to overcome rolling and aero drag. With half that power and real-world drag, 60 mph is not reasonable on any significant grade.
Electric trucks such as the Edison Newton are not intended for highway use - the range is too short to be useful. They're for urban delivery use, and so a 80 km/h (50 mph) top speed on level ground is adequate.
Perhaps, but a usable salvage Duramax (GM pickup/medium-duty V8 diesel) is $5K or more here, and that's for just the bare engine to replace a dead one in a diesel pickup. Add everything else needed, and $15K isn't a generous budget... but of course which currency (USD or Canadian dollars) matters.
And I'm not sure that anyone gets 15 miles per US gallon from a box like that, regardless of engine... assuming that we're talking about real consumption, not a momentary value in zero wind on a flat road at constant speed. I met a guy who put a Cummins and 13-speed in an old bus - with better aero than this motorhome - and was very happy to get 13 miles per imperial gallon (11 miles per US gallon) in a trip from coast to coast (he came from British Columbia and I met him in Nova Scotia).
Brian, I took a look at the specs for a 37 ft Winebago with a V10 turbo to see how it compared to my specs and what I found out was that 1) the front sloped bonnet area and sloped windsheild was flattened (eliminated) which provided 18 in more Coach space but also moved the Batteries, leveler pump, etc. under the coach. Being flat nosed it also multiplies the drag resistance. Engine and Trany weights are basically identical to mine, 2) the GVWR was 23000 compared to mine at 17000. 3) the Trailer tongue weight matched at 1000 lbs but total GVWR of the trailer was reduced to 4000 lbs for a total GCWR of 27000 lbs
So the Winebago at 6000 lbs heavier can pull a trailer of a much lighter weight. Looking at the stripped down F53 chassis for the winebago it comes in at 7100 lbs compared to 6600 lbs.
The big changes are in the structure between the two. The winebago says it has real hardwood floors, Real Wood Cabinets, 3 Pullouts and granite countertops. Probably why it has dual rear axles and dual wheels on each. Each pullout adds 900 lbs, Real wood adds about 1500 lbs, granite adds probably close to 200 lbs. So figuratively we have 3500 lbs of added weight which makes sense since they say structure 8000 lbs compare to mine at 4400 lbs. Curb weight bares this out at 15300 lbs compared to my calculated curb weight of 15100 lbs. Don't know where they got another 200 lbs from.
This brings us to the Payload area. Water and waste water tanks are spec'd at 350 lbs each for fresh and grey and 400 lbs for black water. This would indicate they expect all 3 to be full at 1100 pounds where my specs say 500 lbs total whi;e moving and 1100 max only when parked. Propane volume weight is double my 100 lbs. Fuel is about the same at 760 lbs. This leaves 5840 for people and things compared to mine at 4640 lbs. So the Winebago has 1200 lbs additional carrying capacity than mine has. It;s a full 3 feet longer. and is 6000 lbs heavier. 5800 lbs compared to 23000 is 25% left for people and things and mine isn't much better at 27%.
When you factor in 7 people @ 180lbs that's 1260 lbs, Groceries, linen, Clothing, Dishes at a liberal 1500 lbs and 10 storage bins below rated for 100 lbs each but capable of easily holding more than 200 lbs each and a wealth of inside cupboards rated for 25 to 30 pounds each, and yes you don't have much available and it is far too easy to overload the poor thing.
This isn't my first conversion, back in the early 80's I built a mobile electronics lab into a 1972 dodge van. Everything had to made custom. Being the glutton for punishment that I am I took the box off a 1990 Chevy Extended cab and built a cube with roof overhang and under floor bins to serve as a mobile electronics lab and living camper for field work. 26 years later I hope to make the first EV motorcoach in North America. Europe has had all electric motorcoaches for 5 years now.
Here are the confirmed specs on my motorhome:
1994 Gulfstream sunstream 2000 Motor Coach on an f53 Chassis
...............................................Factory.......EV conversion
Stripped Chassis 6600 lbs 6600 lbs
460 Ford Motor incl -730 lbs
E40D Transmission incl -230 lbs
Fuel Tank incl - 50 lbs
Exhaust, Muffler, Catylitic incl - 85 lbs
. 6600 lbs 5505 lbs
Coach Structure 4400 lbs 4400 lbs
Propane Tank incl incl
1200 Watt Gen set incl - 90 lbs
3500 Watt Gen set added -- 135 lbs
. =========== ==========
Curb Weight 11000 lbs 9950 lbs
Payload Capacity
Water Fresh 6lbs/gal
Water grey 6lbs/gal 500 lbs 500 lbs
Water Black 10lbs/gal
Propane 100 lbs 100 lbs
Fuel 760 lbs --
People and Things 4640 lbs 4640 lbs
. ----------- ----------
. 6000 lbs 5240 lbs
. =========== ==========
17000 lbs 15190 lbs
GVWR 17000 lbs
GVWR Trailer 7000 lbs ** 1000 lbs max hitch tongue weight
GCWR 24000 lbs
Available for Motor Battery & Electronics 1810 lbs
Motor & Invertor & Electronis -200 lbs
Maximum Battery Weight 1610 lbs
Lead Acid cells @65lbs ea @ 700 Watts ea == 25 batteries @19.5 kwh
Lithium Ion cells @6lbs ea @ 700 Watts ea == 268 batteries @209 kwh
On Board 3500Watt charge using propane == 12h == 42kwh / tank $48 per tank 5 Tanks == $250
Shore power charging @30 Amp 120VAC == 12h == 24kwh $ 3.60 4.5 Days == $ 15.66
So the Winebago at 6000 lbs heavier can pull a trailer of a much lighter weight. Looking at the stripped down F53 chassis for the winebago it comes in at 7100 lbs compared to 6600 lbs.
The big changes are in the structure between the two. The winebago says it has real hardwood floors, Real Wood Cabinets, 3 Pullouts and granite countertops. Probably why it has dual rear axles and dual wheels on each. Each pullout adds 900 lbs, Real wood adds about 1500 lbs, granite adds probably close to 200 lbs. So figuratively we have 3500 lbs of added weight which makes sense since they say structure 8000 lbs compare to mine at 4400 lbs. Curb weight bares this out at 15300 lbs compared to my calculated curb weight of 15100 lbs. Don't know where they got another 200 lbs from.
This brings us to the Payload area. Water and waste water tanks are spec'd at 350 lbs each for fresh and grey and 400 lbs for black water. This would indicate they expect all 3 to be full at 1100 pounds where my specs say 500 lbs total whi;e moving and 1100 max only when parked. Propane volume weight is double my 100 lbs. Fuel is about the same at 760 lbs. This leaves 5840 for people and things compared to mine at 4640 lbs. So the Winebago has 1200 lbs additional carrying capacity than mine has. It;s a full 3 feet longer. and is 6000 lbs heavier. 5800 lbs compared to 23000 is 25% left for people and things and mine isn't much better at 27%.
When you factor in 7 people @ 180lbs that's 1260 lbs, Groceries, linen, Clothing, Dishes at a liberal 1500 lbs and 10 storage bins below rated for 100 lbs each but capable of easily holding more than 200 lbs each and a wealth of inside cupboards rated for 25 to 30 pounds each, and yes you don't have much available and it is far too easy to overload the poor thing.
This isn't my first conversion, back in the early 80's I built a mobile electronics lab into a 1972 dodge van. Everything had to made custom. Being the glutton for punishment that I am I took the box off a 1990 Chevy Extended cab and built a cube with roof overhang and under floor bins to serve as a mobile electronics lab and living camper for field work. 26 years later I hope to make the first EV motorcoach in North America. Europe has had all electric motorcoaches for 5 years now.
Here are the confirmed specs on my motorhome:
1994 Gulfstream sunstream 2000 Motor Coach on an f53 Chassis
...............................................Factory.......EV conversion
Stripped Chassis 6600 lbs 6600 lbs
460 Ford Motor incl -730 lbs
E40D Transmission incl -230 lbs
Fuel Tank incl - 50 lbs
Exhaust, Muffler, Catylitic incl - 85 lbs
. 6600 lbs 5505 lbs
Coach Structure 4400 lbs 4400 lbs
Propane Tank incl incl
1200 Watt Gen set incl - 90 lbs
3500 Watt Gen set added -- 135 lbs
. =========== ==========
Curb Weight 11000 lbs 9950 lbs
Payload Capacity
Water Fresh 6lbs/gal
Water grey 6lbs/gal 500 lbs 500 lbs
Water Black 10lbs/gal
Propane 100 lbs 100 lbs
Fuel 760 lbs --
People and Things 4640 lbs 4640 lbs
. ----------- ----------
. 6000 lbs 5240 lbs
. =========== ==========
17000 lbs 15190 lbs
GVWR 17000 lbs
GVWR Trailer 7000 lbs ** 1000 lbs max hitch tongue weight
GCWR 24000 lbs
Available for Motor Battery & Electronics 1810 lbs
Motor & Invertor & Electronis -200 lbs
Maximum Battery Weight 1610 lbs
Lead Acid cells @65lbs ea @ 700 Watts ea == 25 batteries @19.5 kwh
Lithium Ion cells @6lbs ea @ 700 Watts ea == 268 batteries @209 kwh
On Board 3500Watt charge using propane == 12h == 42kwh / tank $48 per tank 5 Tanks == $250
Shore power charging @30 Amp 120VAC == 12h == 24kwh $ 3.60 4.5 Days == $ 15.66
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