[Woodsmith]

I'm sorry, Jim, to hear your illness is preventing you from doing as much as you would like. It will be a shame for you to stop pulling. Your advice will always be valuable even if you no longer compete.
Take care of yourself.

As a sideline (one can't have too many project ideas on the go), I have been doing some calcs and if I used the transfer box as a transaxle for a front drive trike and fitted the chain drive I have of 3.5:1 then I could get a nice 30mph from it with 23" tyres.
If I kept the weight down to 350kg with smooth bodywork plus 48v LiFePO4 pack it will do 30mph at 2.6kW at about 90W/mile.

 

[jackbauer]

You guys are making me think of possible applications for my warp 13

 

[Woodsmith]

You guys are making me think of possible applications for my warp 13

If you want to run with this, Jack, I'm happy to help.

 

[Woodsmith]

So, having stripped the Land Rover axle and got the innards out to play with I happened across a really cheap 2CV gearbox with inboard disc brakes.

To make things simpler and to save weight I will use the gearbox as it is with the motor on the front and have it bolted to a chassis. I will use the Land Rover stub axles and hubs but nothing else. The diff, axle case, shafts and swivel housings, discs and calipers can all be sold on. The 2CV gear ratios are fairly low too so the motor will easily drive it around slowly.

This makes the fun mechanical bit quicker and easier but will get me to the electrical learning curve more effectively.

The 2CV gearbox could also be recycled into a trike later on though my jury is still out considering the pros and cons for front or rear wheel drive.

 

[Salty9]

Woodsmith,

Unless your plywood end cap is only temporary, you might consider coating it with an epoxy paint for oil resistance and putting a stainless band clamp around the circumference to maintain the integrity at the bolt hole locations. It looks good.

Chuck

 

[Dave Koller]

So, having stripped the Land Rover axle and got the innards out to play with I happened across a really cheap 2CV gearbox with inboard disc brakes.

If you feel "the urge" to take a picture - that would be nice .. I am still lurking on this...

 

[Dave Koller]

I know Jim is lurking here also so here is my two "Commie" (Belarus) tractors... Errr they pull - but just around the farm ... Reworked them both -

The snow was in early fall - it would now be up to the first step - lol....

 

[Woodsmith]

Woodsmith,

Unless your plywood end cap is only temporary, you might consider coating it with an epoxy paint for oil resistance and putting a stainless band clamp around the circumference to maintain the integrity at the bolt hole locations. It looks good.

Chuck

The end cap is only temporary, I wanted to test run the motor to find out what it would do before committing myself to further work. I will remake it in aluminium when I know what sort of ounting I will need to make with it.
Same with the splined shaft, I may make another or a different shape one yet.

If you feel "the urge" to take a picture - that would be nice .. I am still lurking on this...

Very lax of me.

I hadn't photographed the axle as it was oily and muddy and out doors in the cold.
Then it was in the work shop in bits being washed.
At neither time did I want to get my phone greasy or take my gloves off until the job was done. I will try and post a workshop view this week end.

 

[Jimdear2]

I know Jim is lurking here also so here is my two "Commie" (Belarus) tractors... Errr they pull - but just around the farm ... Reworked them both -

The snow was in early fall - it would now be up to the first step - lol....

Dave,

Nice looking tractors. Wish I could afford stuff like that. My last tractor was a worn out 1938 Mini Mo. I couldn't afford to fix it when the welsh plugs between the cylinders blocks rusted away so I gave it to a collector for restoration.

Stuff built over here has gotten so expensive I don't blame you for going eslewhere.

Between satisfying the Fat Cat businessmen who need their trophy bonuses, the unions, the vocal minority, and the Governments, there isn't much money left to build anything if you want to stay competitive with companies that don't have to put up with that crap.

Have a great one,

 

[Jimdear2]

The end cap is only temporary, I wanted to test run the motor to find out what it would do before committing myself to further work. I will remake it in aluminium when I know what sort of ounting I will need to make with it.
Same with the splined shaft, I may make another or a different shape one yet.


Very lax of me.

I hadn't photographed the axle as it was oily and muddy and out doors in the cold.
Then it was in the work shop in bits being washed.
At neither time did I want to get my phone greasy or take my gloves off until the job was done. I will try and post a workshop view this week end.

Woody,

What the heck are you trying to build. First off it was a conversion of a lawn/garden tractor. Just a quicky job to learn the electrics so you didn't mess up the real EV.

Now you are out there with THIS axle and THAT transmission. God only knows what kind of steering, brakes, orther axle and chassis you plan to use . That's just a little motor. It sound like you want to haul a City Bus sized vehicle around with it. You can get so lost in a project like that you will never finish your MR2.

This is going to be fun to watch.

Be Well,

 

[Woodsmith]

Jim, I'm just playing, I miss playing with automotive bits but I am more used to playing with huge automotive bits. I have culture shock!

A basic compact tractor, even non running, would cost quite a bit more then I have spent so far.

Anyway, photos.

Just a quick shot from each end of the bench.
Stripped down axle, transfer box, 2CV box, buckets of bits.

 

[Dave Koller]

Looks like you might have fun with all of that Wood

I'll stick to my circuit boards for now lol...

You think those disk brakes come off easy?

Nice and compact - wheelies in the yard ..

 

[Jimdear2]

Woody,

WOW how to you keep your bench so clean

Mine hasen't been that organised in years.

I have lots of started project stuff like this too. I woulkd take pictures but I'm too ashamed.

One of ny pullers uses a VW rabbit transaxle with a D&D ES 15A motor with the motor geared down 2 to 1 using a jackshaft.

I grafted a front end, steering, seat and hood from an old Sears tractor to the frame. I used the Hubs, Brakes and Spindles from a VW Dasher welded into the frame along with stock Rabbit alxes.

I'll attach a picture (ist Picture) of it taken at one of the Clubs shows. I let a few people try it out. Makes for big EV grins, this guy couldn't get enough of it, I had to pry him off. I'll attach another picture of when I was installing the motor. You'll notice how everything is twice as heavy as it needs to be. Got to break myself from overbuilding everything. (2nd picture)

The tractor is a work in progress so it hasent't been repainted yet. It sat out back for a few years once the ICE went bad.

I spent too much time on the Cub (3rd picture) so I didn't get the Different finished. The cub is something like I thought you wanted.

Since you are goung to build something around the size of a compact tractor I would recommend that you find a small 3 speed trans to put in between the 2CV and your motor. That will give you the gear reduction you need.

Then find the biggest rims you can at least 16 inches. Look around for garden tractor breakers and see if you cant find a set of wheels and tires.

By the way the tractor pictured in my signature is the different when it still had the ICE in it.

Sounds like you are just having more fun then is decent.

 

[Dave Koller]

Jim

 

[Woodsmith]

This is what I would have prefered to be working on, the AEC Matador timber tractor I used to have (note the big red estate car parked behind it for scale):

Another previous project I may have posted pics of before:

And the three speed transfer box I built for it:

The transfer box, when complete, probably weighed as much as one of your tractors, Jim!

The bench is only clean and clear because it has only been there for a few weeks.

All this playing is also procrastinating as I am supposed to be writing lesson plans for a history class and waiting for a few more pay cheques before I can get a motor for the MR2.
I am even tempted to use the golf buggy motor and 48v controller on the MR2 just to get it road legal if I haven't got a proper motor for it in the meantime.

 

[Woodsmith]

I've started to clean the 2CV box and have removed the brake calipers, discs and driveshafts.

The calipers are an odd design. The fixing bolts also hold the two sides of the caliper together. So once it is removed it falls apart pushed open by the handbrake/parking brake caliper spring.

Interesting that the drive flange has a locating ring on it but it only locates and centralises the disc. The drive shaft CV joint is only located and centralised by the bolts alone. I guess they had better be a snug fit.

 

[Woodsmith]

I seem to be collecting a lot of cheap mechanical bits.

The latest find is this:

It is the back end of a Ransomes vergecutter and it gives me a two speed transaxle with wheels and hubs and a mount for the motor. The front end has four bolts that will allow a simple front end to be bolted on to take steering and batteries. The ratios are approximately 8.5:1 and 16:1 plus around 3:1 to 4:1 on the pulley.

Now I stop looking and start building, all the other bits will be back on Ebay so I can get some batteries.

The motor will be interchangable from this project to the MR2 to get the MR2 road legal.

 

[Jimdear2]

I seem to be collecting a lot of cheap mechanical bits.

The latest find is this:

It is the back end of a Ransomes vergecutter and it gives me a two speed transaxle with wheels and hubs and a mount for the motor. The front end has four bolts that will allow a simple front end to be bolted on to take steering and batteries. The ratios are approximately 8.5:1 and 16:1 plus around 3:1 to 4:1 on the pulley.

Now I stop looking and start building, all the other bits will be back on Ebay so I can get some batteries.

The motor will be interchangable from this project to the MR2 to get the MR2 road legal.

Woody,

I see you are now on the right track to build a proper tractor thingy.

I can't wait to see what you come up with. Are you going to build your own front end or will you get a generic lawn tractor from the scrap yard? If you go the scrap yard route watch out for some of the really crappy steering systems. All plastic bushings and stamped gears they are usually worn out about a week before you buy it new. Try to find a tractor with a cast Iron front axle, most likely the rest of the steering will be of better quality.

If you build your own give me a shout. I know the angles necessary to get a proper steering for a narrow front end.

If you can find a Ross steering box that would be great. They were used over here on a lot of the high end garden tractors. Do a search on US eBay you will see a lot of them from used to rebuilt $20.00 to $120.00. Once you know what you are looking for maybe you can find one or something similar. You can bring back a total trash Ross gearbox to better then 80% with about 20.00 in bearings, a litle grease And some effort. access to a lathe makes it better.

That rear end looks STRONG and those equipment mounting points look like they would suppoet a lot more the those tires would.

Are we goin to see a piece of art wooden body once you get it moving?

Now I have two things I can't wait for, your tractor thingy and now the 13 inch motor for the new pulling tractor is getting closer to complete. A buddy with a nice shop is letting my partner in this project and me use equipment when it's free. I have the movable brush rigging almost done, we will have the keyway in place by Thursday (man that shaft is hard) The end bells have been machined down and cleaned up for Powder Kote. We will clean up the barrel through the week. The end bells will be chrome silver and the barrel will be electric blue metal flake with yellow lightning bolts.

I hope you plan on replacing that wood motor end plate since this will be a side winder. Though it might be OK with a properly supported shaft.

Sorry to run on so but I am just happy to see the tractor thingy going forward.

I'll be watching
Jim

 

[Woodsmith]

Cheers Jim.
It only cost me £10 at the scrap metal yard!

I'll look forward to the 13" photos on your thread and some more pulling video.

I have ordered a 22mm thick aluminium plate from Ebay to make a new end cap for the motor.
I figured that if I kept the outside of the plate square then it would give me 4 lugs for bolting down to the adaptor plate on the MR2. It would be bigger then my lathe would chuck but I realised that if I removed the chuck and bolted the plate to the chuck drive plate then I could use the gap in the bed to get 10" diameter swing.

I will be using the short splined shaft I made earlier to take a pulley and I think that if I mounded it between two bearings then there will be no radial load on the motor. It would also allow the motor to be slipped off the shaft to use on the MR2 until it gets its own motor.

I was going to make the front end as, having found a lawn tractor grave yard, the ones available were costly and looked more suited to a child's pedal cart. Any advice would be great as I was going to just make an 'agricutural' center pivot beam axle with simple (and approximate) akerman steering. It will only have a speed of 0.7 and 1.3 mph per 1000rpm in each gear if I use a 4:1 pulley drive.

This week I will be busy as I have to prepare a couple of pieces of my furniture work to be used for a HRH visit to work. I will have a Royal bottom on my chair, signing papers on my table. If it works out it will be a great publicity photo for my website.

 

[Jimdear2]

Cheers Jim.
It only cost me £10 at the scrap metal yard!

I'll look forward to the 13" photos on your thread and some more pulling video.

I have ordered a 22mm thick aluminium plate from Ebay to make a new end cap for the motor.
I figured that if I kept the outside of the plate square then it would give me 4 lugs for bolting down to the adaptor plate on the MR2. It would be bigger then my lathe would chuck but I realised that if I removed the chuck and bolted the plate to the chuck drive plate then I could use the gap in the bed to get 10" diameter swing.

I will be using the short splined shaft I made earlier to take a pulley and I think that if I mounded it between two bearings then there will be no radial load on the motor. It would also allow the motor to be slipped off the shaft to use on the MR2 until it gets its own motor.

I was going to make the front end as, having found a lawn tractor grave yard, the ones available were costly and looked more suited to a child's pedal cart. Any advice would be great as I was going to just make an 'agricutural' center pivot beam axle with simple (and approximate) akerman steering. It will only have a speed of 0.7 and 1.3 mph per 1000rpm in each gear if I use a 4:1 pulley drive.

This week I will be busy as I have to prepare a couple of pieces of my furniture work to be used for a HRH visit to work. I will have a Royal bottom on my chair, signing papers on my table. If it works out it will be a great publicity photo for my website.

Woody,

Great news about HRH. Post a picture on this site if you can.

Sound like you have the motor set up well in hand. what you describe for drive shafting should do the job. Think about an overdrive jackshaft set up to maybe try to get the top speed up around 5mph. Over all it would be more usable. Belt drive should be fine.

Couple of questions about the Tractor Thingy (called TT in the future).
General questions:



Does the TT

• Have a real differential?
• Have any kind of brakes?
• Have a reverse?

Questions related to the potential front end:

• What size will the OD of the final rear wheels and tires be?
• What will the center to center width of the final rear tires be?
• What diameter front wheels?
• What is the planned width (center to center of the tires)?

Suggestions:
See if the lawn tractor yard might not have a couple of usable spindles or even a completefront axle with wheel and tires. The spindles alone will save you half of the figuring and work because the ackerman steering offset and KPI is already built into the units.

If you are going totally from scratch a good general spec. for the ackerman steering offset is 15 degrees per side and a good general KPI is also 15 degreese. For the standard garden tractor front wheel that will put the SAI contact close to the center of the tire with a 2 degree +- camber.

From there, once you know front and rear tire diameters it is easy to set up caster, trail, camber and SAI.

I know you might be saying, is this needed on something only going am couple of miles an hour? But I bet that in the end it will go faster, plus it will be heavy with the batteries so you might as well make steering as acurate and easy as possible.

A thought:
Check on what if any costs iof any are involved import wise if I were to send you a pair of spindles as a gift. They would probably be classed as used auto parts or some such. I have three or four pair sitting around that I will never use. I don't think the shipping would be too bad. I'll weigh them and see.

As far as the Big 13, I guess I better start a build thread. I'll take my camera over with me next week and snap a few of the motor worl we are doing at the shop.

TT forever,
Jim

EDIT.

Sorry; Didn't read/understand that you have the MPH in hand with a 4 to 1 drive. Ignore the jack shaft suggestion.

End EDIT