[CKidder]

No I am not sure at all. That is in fact my biggest concern. I have not found any wiring diagrams yet but right now I am focused on the battery. I am worried that the only way to get it work is if it can communicate with all of the other controllers on board. You see this a lot in engine swaps and it is can be a mess unless you can reflash the ECU.

The way the Prius (at least the older 2004 version jddcircuit has) works is dead stupid. I cannot imagine how anyone could make a setup like that and sleep at night. The Toyota engineers should be ashamed. I also cannot imagine that a nearly new Volt would work like that at all. CANBus control of vehicle hardware is very common these days and would be a fairly reasonable guess. Canbus works over two wires and at very low voltage (around 0 to 1.4V differential between the wires). Unfortunately, without a schematic it could be interesting to find those two wires if they even exist. They would likely be twisted together and needn't be very large.

If it is canbus controlled (and I'd be 90% sure it is) then I just might know somebody who likes to hack on canbus controlled hardware. The hardware and software exist but tend to be expensive. There are, however, people who are working to change that.

What I'm really trying to say is: I helped build a replacement ECU for electric cars and I've also been turning that same ECU into a reverse engineering tool to crack new hardware. After the comm scheme is reverse engineered the same ECU used for the reverse engineering is then re-flashed to actually drive the hardware. This should save time and money and lead to less wasted hardware.

 

[jddcircuit]

The way the Prius (at least the older 2004 version jddcircuit has) works is dead stupid.

blessing to some curse to others

 

[kerrymann]

http://www.lem.com/docs/products/dhab%20s44.pdf

heater is in input coolant manifold, orange 2 wire plug about 1/8 dia pins

each module has temp sensor.

two in metal endplate coolant manifolds, one in fuse (at least there is an impedance) two in wire charge plugs, thought they were T/C might be thermistors.

Thanks!

The way the Prius (at least the older 2004 version jddcircuit has) works is dead stupid. I cannot imagine how anyone could make a setup like that and sleep at night. The Toyota engineers should be ashamed. I also cannot imagine that a nearly new Volt would work like that at all. CANBus control of vehicle hardware is very common these days and would be a fairly reasonable guess. Canbus works over two wires and at very low voltage (around 0 to 1.4V differential between the wires). Unfortunately, without a schematic it could be interesting to find those two wires if they even exist. They would likely be twisted together and needn't be very large.

If it is canbus controlled (and I'd be 90% sure it is) then I just might know somebody who likes to hack on canbus controlled hardware. The hardware and software exist but tend to be expensive. There are, however, people who are working to change that.

What I'm really trying to say is: I helped build a replacement ECU for electric cars and I've also been turning that same ECU into a reverse engineering tool to crack new hardware. After the comm scheme is reverse engineered the same ECU used for the reverse engineering is then re-flashed to actually drive the hardware. This should save time and money and lead to less wasted hardware.

Sounds good to me. What to work on one for a volt? I am still trying to get a hold of a wiring diagram and hopefully it is all canbus but we will see. I have been busy in the barn dealing with permit issues upgrading my barn with 100amp service but that is another story.

Looks like Jack posted parts of my videos on EVTV but there wasn't much lead in. I was hoping that would help get people interested in cracking the wiring of the inverter but I think he has more projects then can handle as it is.

 

[CKidder]

Sounds good to me. What to work on one for a volt? I am still trying to get a hold of a wiring diagram and hopefully it is all canbus but we will see. I have been busy in the barn dealing with permit issues upgrading my barn with 100amp service but that is another story.

Looks like Jack posted parts of my videos on EVTV but there wasn't much lead in. I was hoping that would help get people interested in cracking the wiring of the inverter but I think he has more projects then can handle as it is.

The Volt may or may not have multiple can buses. I'm told that the Leaf has three of them. The GEVCU hardware is intrinsically capable of connecting to two buses at once. So, what's left is to figure out how many buses the Volt uses and where they are. Almost certainly at least one exists and is on the OBDII connector. So, that's a start.

I'm actually working on making an Arduino IDE capable canbus to USB dongle. It will essentially be a modified copy of the GEVCU hardware but without the hardware I/O and significantly cheaper. My initial plan is to have it under $100 and still be galvanically isolated and dual bus. So, that gives another option for monitoring. The bonus with that idea is that you don't need to repurpose a big ECU for reverse engineering. Also, the little dongle will have a DB9 connector and multiple plugs will be possible. This will allow for using it on a Leaf with the proper plug or a Volt with the proper plug, etc.

Yes, Jack has a lot of projects and it seems like he's backed off of the vehicle reverse engineering a bit but I haven't so we're still a go. Without his support the process might be a bit slower but it'll get figured out. And, if such things start producing fruit it'll make it more enticing for him as well.

 

[kerrymann]

According to people on the volt forum, these guys are supposed to have wiring diagrams for the volt but I have been trying to sign up for a account for the past week with no luck:

http://www.autocats.ws

 

[dotrick]

Hello,

I bought a Chevy Volt Battery too... I'm looking for some informations about the CAN Bus and BMS.
Do you have an electrical schema to switch on the BMS and read messages on CAN BUS?


Thank you

 

[crashedup]

Hello! this is a message to the moderators!
There should be a new title in the forum for hacking oem ev's, where everyone who has tried or has info on oem ev parts, because that is our future as DIY. It is the cheapest route out there and we end up with high qulity parts from junk yards for peanuts!
Example; I called around and a battery pack out of a volt or leaf goes for around $2000, and that's without negociation because they have no idea what to do with the stuff! Imagin if we could use everything from a leaf or volt, motor, charger, battery. We could make a sub $10,000 quality ev!

 

[kerrymann]

Hey all,
Sorry for the lack of updates. I realized I haven't posted anything here but I did crack a lot more into the volt pack and started putting up more videos of what I found along with progress on the e30:

https://www.youtube.com/user/d55guy/videos

I will be putting up more this weekend.

I am working with Jack's group on reverse engineering the components taking captures from my 2013. They gave me a candue and it is a bit of a learning curve on the CAN but things are progressing. It really helps having my volt that I can use to sniff the canbus while doing specific operations.

I have spent most of my time on the battery side. I have stripped down a few packs and developed my own mounting system. I was so anxious to test it all I pulled the enerdel that I just put in my e30 and put in most of a volt pack and wired it all up to my Soliton1. If I can get a throttle figured out this weekend I hope to take it for a test spin.

 

[eldis]

Hey all,
Sorry for the lack of updates. I realized I haven't posted anything here but I did crack a lot more into the volt pack and started putting up more videos of what I found along with progress on the e30:

https://www.youtube.com/user/d55guy/videos

I will be putting up more this weekend.

Thanks for the work you're putting in the videos!
I'm just going through the videos related to the battery - you got some things a bit wrong, so I would like to clarify it (didn't finish watching it all yet).

Battery interface module:
- The big ceramic white resistors are not heaters, they are precharge resistors. They are used together with a precharge relay (one of the small relays) and a MOSFET PWM, to ramp up the voltage before the main contactor turns on (so you don't get any sparking).
- One of the water connectors contains a HV heater (working from a pack voltage), again, controlled by one MOSFET
- All precharge, heater and contactors can be controlled externally, not using BMS module (it does not interface to it at all). Using X1 and X2 external connectors

I did reverse engineer most of the Chevy Volt drivetrain, but I'm still analyzing bits here and there, so I didn't want to release an incomplete documentation. Write me a PM if you want to cooperate on it.

 

[kerrymann]

Thanks for the work you're putting in the videos!
I'm just going through the videos related to the battery - you got some things a bit wrong, so I would like to clarify it (didn't finish watching it all yet).

Battery interface module:
- The big ceramic white resistors are not heaters, they are precharge resistors. They are used together with a precharge relay (one of the small relays) and a MOSFET PWM, to ramp up the voltage before the main contactor turns on (so you don't get any sparking).
- One of the water connectors contains a HV heater (working from a pack voltage), again, controlled by one MOSFET
- All precharge, heater and contactors can be controlled externally, not using BMS module (it does not interface to it at all). Using X1 and X2 external connectors

I did reverse engineer most of the Chevy Volt drivetrain, but I'm still analyzing bits here and there, so I didn't want to release an incomplete documentation. Write me a PM if you want to cooperate on it.

Duh, precharge resistors. Of course, it's obvious now. I was looking for a heater and saw those and jumped to the wrong conclusion. I will correct it. Thanks.

There are a couple other things I need to change or update in the videos. I find myself having time to work on the cars, or shoot videos, or edit the stuff, but not the time to do all of them. I tried having a family friend with the video editing (hence the goofy intros) but it did not work out.

Anyway, I will send you a PM. There is already a group of about a dozen of us working on the volt and the leaf and the more the better

 

[piotrsko]

Heater is in the passenger side water cooling manifold. 2 pin Orange connector going to relay module ( I think, mine is scattered).

Relays are good for average 10 amps on the small, 350-400 amps on the big mains, 600ish break on a one shot over current event. Nice panasonic hydrogen suppressed contacts which disassemble using a torx

Flat oem wires good (so far) 250 amp. I got nervous and yanked them.

Current sensor between module 1 & 2 is a 2 part hall sensor good to 400 amps or 20 amps. Rubber center plug. Offset is 3.80, voltage declines to 0. I am running it on 5 vdc, goes to 12. Building an inverted opamp to drive my jdh 404.

 

[ElementalEnergy]

Hey folks. We are getting ready to purchase a Chevy Volt battery pack from a pretty new wrecked volt (was hit in the front). Since they just got the whole car in, we were wondering if there are any other bits and pieces that it might be worth pilfering from the car. Cooling pumps, contactors, heater etc??

Thought you all might have some insight after digging around in these parts for awhile. Any bits and pieces that might be nice to have around for our build? Thanks so much for putting in all that work!

Build thread here:
http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php/planning-1985-vw-doka-conversion-140210.html

 

[piotrsko]

Depends on how you get the car. If it is your car with complete access, then everything you might think you need. If it is their car and you are buying parts that they yank, power steering pump, battery coolant pump, battery charger control module, A/C compressor pump, both ends of any harnesses for the modules you buy. All the contractors that are worthy are in the battery, everything else is CAN controlled. The wrecking yard is going to hacksaw or cutting torch stuff out, cut harnesses, and just generally booger up the removal unless you are there to supervise. Make sure you get the disconnect safety inert plug from the top of the battery, I hear chevy is prissy about selling replacements.

GET THE VIN # !!!!!! That helps the dealership sell you stuff.

BTW us old guys call that a combi

 

[kerrymann]

Besides the obvious stuff get the charger on the passenger side front bumper if It is not damaged (Often it is). It has been hacked and its a nice unit.

There is the DC DC converter in the trunk which can put out some serious power.
The J1772 inlet is a good quality one. Check the truck for a 110v charge cord. The volt has EPS so useless you can make the whole rack work the power steering won't be easily used. The heater is a good one too and I just picked one up to start hacking (100 bucks). I would pick up the coolant pump and heat exchanger for the battery system. Definitely get every wiring connector for every part you buy withth a min 6" pig tail.

 

[kerrymann]

I got a round to putting up some more videos. People kept asking me about how and where to get them:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RbcbhGPp2PQ

And also I got some good information about the power capability of these volt packs courtesy of the DOE:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HYrhykqpyj4

Sorry in advances as they are kind of long an rambling but if I waited around to edit them they would never get posted (not unlike the other hours of video sitting on my hard drive)

I hope they are helpful,

 

[agent005]

Thanks for the work you're putting in the videos!
I'm just going through the videos related to the battery - you got some things a bit wrong, so I would like to clarify it (didn't finish watching it all yet).

Battery interface module:
- The big ceramic white resistors are not heaters, they are precharge resistors. They are used together with a precharge relay (one of the small relays) and a MOSFET PWM, to ramp up the voltage before the main contactor turns on (so you don't get any sparking).
- One of the water connectors contains a HV heater (working from a pack voltage), again, controlled by one MOSFET
- All precharge, heater and contactors can be controlled externally, not using BMS module (it does not interface to it at all). Using X1 and X2 external connectors

I did reverse engineer most of the Chevy Volt drivetrain, but I'm still analyzing bits here and there, so I didn't want to release an incomplete documentation. Write me a PM if you want to cooperate on it.

Hello eldis, you seem to know a lot about the volt and its internal workings quite a bit, I was wondering if you could help me out with a restoration project involving a wrecked (poor thing should have actually been totalled) 2012 chevy volt.

I have completely rebuilt the car and am having an issue with the precharge relay contactors (GM service procedures have directed me to replace the junction block relay which contains the high voltage contactor pack, which I have done. (cost me $768 bucks and apparently they have sent me a dud) I cannot get a return/exchange because they apparently dont do returns on electric componets and its outside of the 30 day window, I have emailed them asking anyway with my fingers crossed (awaiting a response)

The reason for replacing the junction block relay/contactor assembly is due to the fact that during any collision involving deployment of the airbag systems creates a high current condition in which can potentially damage the internal contactors in the junction block, service procedures direct replacing the contactor assembly/junction block relay as one of the first things to do.
I have done that, and still did not work, so i proceeded to do circuit/system testing and have concluded that the replacement relay/junction block they sent me must be a dud.

I was wondering rather than shelling out more big bucks for another contactor assembly if you could tell me or show me where the precharge relay is and what should be the output voltages once the relay is energized inside of the contactor assembly? I can attempt to replace the relay itself with an aftermarket version and get the car back on the road.

much appreciated! I'd be happy to throw you a bone for it too

 

[eldis]

Hello eldis, you seem to know a lot about the volt and its internal workings quite a bit, I was wondering if you could help me out with a restoration project involving a wrecked (poor thing should have actually been totalled) 2012 chevy volt.

I have completely rebuilt the car and am having an issue with the precharge relay contactors (GM service procedures have directed me to replace the junction block relay which contains the high voltage contactor pack, which I have done. (cost me $768 bucks and apparently they have sent me a dud) I cannot get a return/exchange because they apparently dont do returns on electric componets and its outside of the 30 day window, I have emailed them asking anyway with my fingers crossed (awaiting a response)

The reason for replacing the junction block relay/contactor assembly is due to the fact that during any collision involving deployment of the airbag systems creates a high current condition in which can potentially damage the internal contactors in the junction block, service procedures direct replacing the contactor assembly/junction block relay as one of the first things to do.
I have done that, and still did not work, so i proceeded to do circuit/system testing and have concluded that the replacement relay/junction block they sent me must be a dud.

I was wondering rather than shelling out more big bucks for another contactor assembly if you could tell me or show me where the precharge relay is and what should be the output voltages once the relay is energized inside of the contactor assembly? I can attempt to replace the relay itself with an aftermarket version and get the car back on the road.

much appreciated! I'd be happy to throw you a bone for it too

Hi agent005, I don't fully agree with that procedure in the service manual.

If the relay/junction box is the one sitting in front of the battery box, there is no need to replace it after crash. Many of us bought a pulled battery pack from a crashed Volt, and nobody reported any problems with this module (truth is, not everyone is using it..) Of course it could happen, that these contactors die as they are opened under the load (crash event). Normally they are opened in steady state condition with no current, to protect contacts. These modules can be easily tested, if you have some basic equipment available. On the connector X1 and X2 (round multipin on the module down) there are several relays that you can turn on by simply bringing 12V to them. Then you just measure with a multimeter if you do get voltage on the output (or you pull the module out and test it without the HV pack). You need to open both big relays at the same time to get HV on the output. Be careful when doing this, as you will have 400V exposed very close to your hands.

I had a better document that I've written for this, but can't find it now. Write me a PM if you want to help with the troubleshooting, so we don't spam this thread.

 

[YogaSlackerSam]

hey Chevy volt Gurus,

Wondering if it is possible to put 5 volt battery packs together to get a 90kwh pack?

We are building a 4x4 overlander micro house and looking for 100 mile range for a 7000 pound aerodynamically challenged rig.

thanks in advance.

Sam

 

[TexomaEV]

Great photos, What progress have you made since ? I would love to know if one could purchase a GM Tech2 Scanner w/TIS2000 access and tune/change various programming parameters within the Volt. Or some other similar, maybe less expensive tuner.

 

[elcapitansd]

Hi Guys,

This drivetrain looks nice for $1K - comparable to a replacement motor. What do you think of dropping the entire thing into a nice kit car of a porsche or something with regen braking? Thoughts? I am on the Mexican Border here in San Diego and we could easily start a small time customized volt drivetrain kit car operation. Labor Costs at $500/mo per factory worker.

Thank You,

Steven, a tinkerer who got sidetracked by getting an MBA